Betty goes "Brrrrrrr...."
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Thread: Betty goes "Brrrrrrr...."

  1. #1
    Senior Member Fred's Avatar
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    Betty goes "Brrrrrrr...."

    Perhaps some of you recall my ongoing saga of repairing my TW200 a.k.a. Betty Boop, following a bent valve incident following a fuel starvation scenario. I installed a serviceable head given by the ever so generous Admiral and buttoned up everything but engine runs terrible despite trying to confirm everything ok.
    Symptoms are engine starts fine with half choke tonight in 40 degree temps but only runs at a rough few thousand r.p.m.s irregardless of throttle position, then stalls after 30 seconds or so. Sounds rough and possibly rich, really only wants to run with full trottle, although at only 2000 rpm max.

    Things I have already checked and may need to double check:
    valve clearance
    cam sprocket timing
    air leaks around carb
    clean air filter
    good spark
    good fuel delivery to and through carburetor
    fresh fuel
    float level set while disassembled then confirmed with clear "pitot tube" once on bike according to manual supplement ( Betty is a 2003 with ~9000 miles and a stock engine and exhuast)
    air in tires

    So, what am I forgetting? Symptoms sound familiar to anyone?
    By the way I never really identified cause of fuel starvation.
    I do have brand new mixture screw and float valve/seat/o-ring but did not install them as old ones seemed undamaged.
    Any comments will be greatly appreciated.
    I can video and post engine sounds tomorrow if anyone thinks this might be diagnostic.
    2003 TW200 "Betty Boop"
    2006 TW200 "Nibbler", a.k.a. “Mr.Gizmo"
    Hidden Content All Things Considered I’ld Rather Be Motorcycling

  2. #2
    Senior Member Dryden-Tdub's Avatar
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    I am sorry to hear this news Fred. Since I am not a mechanic I will bounce off of here and make room for the smart people. I hope there is a quick fix and you are off and running soon. Take care.




    Tom
    It won't be greed which destroys America. It will be envy.

    Man who runs in front of motorcycle gets tired. Man who runs behind motorcycle gets exhausted.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Borneo's Avatar
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    Over my head too I'm afraid.

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  5. #4
    Senior Member silverwing's Avatar
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    I had the same problem with my 2005 TW after a carb cleaning. The main nozzle fell out while the carb was apart and I was unaware of it, and reassembled the carb and and put it back on the TW, and it ran like crap, similar to your conditions. I removed the carb several times, hoping to find the problem, to no aval. I went to the pole barn for something else when I found a shinny little metal thing laying on the floor,and wondering what it is for. Still disgusted with the TW, I removed the carb again and took it apart, and shure enough, that little part was for the TW, put it in, reinstalled the carb, started it up and went for a nice ride,smiling ear to ear, it ran great. I hope this helps you. That shinny thing is called a main nozzle on the TW carb parts breakdown, item #12, which you can find at www.stadiumyamaha.com
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  6. #5
    Senior Member arbolmano's Avatar
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    Hey Fred That's is a bogus. Check your sparkplug by swapping out another
    just on a off chance. The holy trinity of gas engines are fuel, compression and spark.
    Sounds like you've ruled out fuel, how is the compression? Need min 100 psi to run. You can kinda guess based
    on how the kick starter feels compared to before. If fuel is ruled out, compression ruled out
    then it's spark, more specific is amount and timing. Lizarbrth had a great thread on testing timing. But a timing light
    is the tool required, need to make sure you have strong spark all the time and it's advancing proper. Easiest test
    is to swap a known good CDi unit if there is someone nearby with one you could borrow.
    Wonky advance in ignition will mimic fuel problems as will low compression. Big chain parts stores
    rent out compression gauges and timing lights. Good luck
    Fred likes this.
    Tonto on the "Left Coast"
    1987 TW200 (2) 2015 BMW F700GS
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  7. #6
    Senior Member arbolmano's Avatar
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    So Silverwing could have a point, could the perp of the valve collision been
    part of your carb? If so it would be in the exhaust but wouldn't explain
    your failure to be conclusive on the original "fuel starvation" problem. But wouldn't hurt to
    pull header pipe and shake it out and or pull carb and search for missing parts.
    Tonto on the "Left Coast"
    1987 TW200 (2) 2015 BMW F700GS
    More Wagging and less Barking
    "Enjoy yourself, it's later than you think"
    Make Love not War

  8. #7
    Senior Member Fred's Avatar
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    Thanks guys, will check all the above. Never thought to use my compression tester as I assumed that was solved. Thanks for reminding me of my favorite admonition: Test Your Assumptions. Always good to differentiate that which you know from that which you think. For example I think I reassembled carb correctly, no missing nozzles or clogged passeges. And while NGK plug seems to spark strongly why not test with that E3 plug hiding somewhere in the parts box?
    What else? Would she even fire if 180 degrees out of time?
    Maybe I should have pulled muffler for a shake out. Nothing was in headpipe but I'll pull muffler mañana.
    Last edited by Fred; 01-24-2015 at 08:42 PM.
    2003 TW200 "Betty Boop"
    2006 TW200 "Nibbler", a.k.a. “Mr.Gizmo"
    Hidden Content All Things Considered I’ld Rather Be Motorcycling

  9. #8
    Senior Member arbolmano's Avatar
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    Compression will tell you if it's cam is out of time, more than one tooth and
    it probably won't run or would have valve collison. But loose chain or just one tooth off
    will dramatically change spark timing. Spark in open air a differnt animal
    than spark under compression with fuel air mixture. Need to jump a good 1/8" in open air.
    You can fab up an air gap tool and check spark whilst running. Timing light will tell you same thing
    more or less. My psychic sense is saying bad "CDI" but I put littel faith in that.
    Tonto on the "Left Coast"
    1987 TW200 (2) 2015 BMW F700GS
    More Wagging and less Barking
    "Enjoy yourself, it's later than you think"
    Make Love not War

  10. #9
    Senior Member Dryden-Tdub's Avatar
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    Most mornings I wake up with a manana. Sorry Fred couldn't resist. I am weak.


    Tom
    It won't be greed which destroys America. It will be envy.

    Man who runs in front of motorcycle gets tired. Man who runs behind motorcycle gets exhausted.

  11. #10
    Senior Member Fred's Avatar
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    Tom, I have heard of Morning Wood, but are you referring to Morning Fruit ?
    Last edited by Fred; 01-24-2015 at 09:16 PM.
    Dryden-Tdub likes this.
    2003 TW200 "Betty Boop"
    2006 TW200 "Nibbler", a.k.a. “Mr.Gizmo"
    Hidden Content All Things Considered I’ld Rather Be Motorcycling

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