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Thread: Neutral Switch Problem?

  1. #1
    Junior Member adaulton's Avatar
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    Hello,



    I have recently installed the new Trail Tech Voyager GPS/Speedo. (I will post pictures soon.) Everything went pretty well. But when I put it all back together, my neutral switch (I think) is no longer working. The indicator light won't come on and the bike will not start in neutral alone as it used to. I can still get it started with the clutch in and side-stand up. I am not very good with electrical systems so I would really appreciate it if someone could help me out with troubleshooting this.



    Here is some information about what I did that may have contributed to the problem... I hope talking through this will hint to a possible solution.



    I installed the computer in place of the indicator light box so I could have it sit beside my stock speedo/odometer. It also made sense to put it here because I had lost the meter box a few weeks ago during my participation in the La/Barstow to Vegas ride. For the past few weeks, I had been looking at blank bulbs without the cover. All the indicators and the neutral switch seemed to still be working at that point. During the Voyager installation, I removed the indicator bulbs and sockets from the rubber piece and pulled the "SOCKET CORD ASSY" 15A-83509-00-00 away from that area and re-routed it. (I had a plan to modify and relocate the indicator lights.)



    So after the install I put everything back together and started it up. The neutral switch still worked as I let it run with the stand down while I messed around with the computer a bit. I let one or more of the bare bulb sockets (maybe the neutral one) hit metal and it sparked and the headlight dimmed. DAMN. I had neglected to tape them up before messing around with the power on. So I stopped the engine and turned the key off. After securing the bare sockets, I tried to restart the bike but the fuse had blown. After replacing the fuse and trying to restart is when I think I first noticed the neutral switch not functioning properly. I had to stop working on it however, and I guess I forgot about it after that. (I usually only start with the clutch in and the stand up.) It was about a week later after getting LED replacements for my indicators. that I realized that the indicator would not light and I remembered the starting issue.



    So now I am trying to locate the problem. I may pulled a bit on the wiring harness as I was moving the socket assembly. But it seems like all the circuits have continuity where I have tested and everything looks well seated. Although I don't not trust myself at all when It comes to electrical repair.



    I feel like I am in way over my head here, but the problem is not stopping me from being able to ride and therefore not something I want to spend money on to take it to a shop. It is really just more annoying than anything else. But I hate having issues like this. It really eats at me and distracts me from other projects.



    I guess I should maybe start by replacing the neutral switch itself (or the relay?). They are cheap enough. But I don't want to just start replacing parts not knowing that the problem is.



    Can anyone give me suggestions to help diagnose this? I would greatly appreciate it.



    Thanks,

    Ash

  2. #2
    Senior Member heyduke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey Logic View Post
    Hello,



    I have recently installed the new Trail Tech Voyager GPS/Speedo. (I will post pictures soon.) Everything went pretty well. But when I put it all back together, my neutral switch (I think) is no longer working. The indicator light won't come on and the bike will not start in neutral alone as it used to. I can still get it started with the clutch in and side-stand up. I am not very good with electrical systems so I would really appreciate it if someone could help me out with troubleshooting this.



    Here is some information about what I did that may have contributed to the problem... I hope talking through this will hint to a possible solution.



    I installed the computer in place of the indicator light box so I could have it sit beside my stock speedo/odometer. It also made sense to put it here because I had lost the meter box a few weeks ago during my participation in the La/Barstow to Vegas ride. For the past few weeks, I had been looking at blank bulbs without the cover. All the indicators and the neutral switch seemed to still be working at that point. During the Voyager installation, I removed the indicator bulbs and sockets from the rubber piece and pulled the "SOCKET CORD ASSY" 15A-83509-00-00 away from that area and re-routed it. (I had a plan to modify and relocate the indicator lights.)



    So after the install I put everything back together and started it up. The neutral switch still worked as I let it run with the stand down while I messed around with the computer a bit. I let one or more of the bare bulb sockets (maybe the neutral one) hit metal and it sparked and the headlight dimmed. DAMN. I had neglected to tape them up before messing around with the power on. So I stopped the engine and turned the key off. After securing the bare sockets, I tried to restart the bike but the fuse had blown. After replacing the fuse and trying to restart is when I think I first noticed the neutral switch not functioning properly. I had to stop working on it however, and I guess I forgot about it after that. (I usually only start with the clutch in and the stand up.) It was about a week later after getting LED replacements for my indicators. that I realized that the indicator would not light and I remembered the starting issue.



    So now I am trying to locate the problem. I may pulled a bit on the wiring harness as I was moving the socket assembly. But it seems like all the circuits have continuity where I have tested and everything looks well seated. Although I don't not trust myself at all when It comes to electrical repair.



    I feel like I am in way over my head here, but the problem is not stopping me from being able to ride and therefore not something I want to spend money on to take it to a shop. It is really just more annoying than anything else. But I hate having issues like this. It really eats at me and distracts me from other projects.



    I guess I should maybe start by replacing the neutral switch itself (or the relay?). They are cheap enough. But I don't want to just start replacing parts not knowing that the problem is.



    Can anyone give me suggestions to help diagnose this? I would greatly appreciate it.



    Thanks,

    Ash


    I am not sure what your problem "IS" but I think I know what it "ISN'T". You mention replacing the relay. It more that likely isn't the relay. It would not start with the clutch in if it were.

  3. #3
    Senior Member BBMS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey Logic View Post
    during my participation in the La/Barstow to Vegas ride.
    Ash, I can't help you with your problem, but I'm sure you will get to the source soon. I would, however, love to read about your La/Barstow adventure. Mark

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  5. #4
    Junior Member adaulton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heyduke View Post
    I am not sure what your problem "IS" but I think I know what it "ISN'T". You mention replacing the relay. It more that likely isn't the relay. It would not start with the clutch in if it were.




    Excellent. This is exactly the kind of information I am looking for. Thanks so much. Seems like it has to be either the switch itself or wires or connections. If I can eliminate (or add) possibilities, I will be able to get to the bottom of this.



    As far as I can tell, there is continuity in the circuit (oddly whether it is in neutral or not). Maybe also evidence by the fact it starts with the clutch in? Again, I admit, I am completely ignorant in my understanding of electrical systems.



    Does anyone know if there is a way to test the switch itself? I haven't even tried because of the annoyance of removing the case cover, etc. And I don't understand the diagram for testing it in the supplemental manual. It looks like: ground-single break-sky blue wire-(two concentric circles broken by a line at the bottom?). But I do have an extra few gaskets and I am prepared to open it up and test it if someone could describe how.



    Thanks again for help on this,

    Ash

  6. #5
    Banned qwerty's Avatar
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    It is unlikely that you have damaged the neutral switch. That switch is a normally open, and when it closes it grounds. Shorting the indicator to ground at the socket merely bypasses the switch. Anywho, the neutral switch is simple to check.Isolate the neutral safety switch from the rest of the electrics and slap an ohm meter across it. The procedure varies between early and late models.



    Assuming 2001 or newer.

    Access the light blue wire leading to the indicator panel and disconnect from the panel.

    Disconnect the sky blue wire from the neutral relay under the right side cover.

    Connect an ohm meter from the light blue wire in either plug to ground. In neutral there should be no resistance--the switch is closed. In gear, their should be infinite resistance--the switch is open.



    Assuming 2000 or older.

    Access the light blue wire leading to the indicator panel and disconnect from the panel.

    Disconnect the sky blue wire from the ignition circuit cutoff relay under the right side cover.

    Disconnect the sky blue wire from the starting circuit cutoff relay under the right side cover.

    Connect an ohm meter from the light blue wire in any plug to ground.

    In neutral there should be no resistance--the switch is closed. In gear, there should be infinite resistance--the switch is open.



    You can use a powered test light or beeper instead of an ohm meter. The light should be on or the beeper beeping in neutral, off in gear.



    This procedure tests not only the neutral safety switch, but also the portion of the wiring harness between the switch and the plug where tested. You can check all the harness associated with the neutral safety switch by checking at both or all three plugs, depending on year.



    If the above test fails, then it would be wise to open the engine and test the switch separate from the harness, and test the harness separate from the switch.



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  7. #6
    Junior Member adaulton's Avatar
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    Thank you, thank you. I really appreciate the help. I have a 2004 model. Sorry I didn't specify.



    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty View Post
    Access the light blue wire leading to the indicator panel and disconnect from the panel.
    This was easy enough.



    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty View Post
    Disconnect the sky blue wire from the neutral relay under the right side cover.
    I see the relay and the light blue wire(s) going into the connector. Do I need to actually remove the wires from the connector? Or is it sufficient to simply unplug the whole connector? I can't see an easy way to get the clip out of the connector to isolate the light blue wires.



    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty View Post
    Connect an ohm meter from the light blue wire in either plug to ground. In neutral there should be no resistance--the switch is closed. In gear, their should be infinite resistance--the switch is open.
    Assuming unplugging the whole relay will allow an accurate test, I have infinite resistance whether in neutral or not. And if my assumption is correct, I will get in there tomorrow night and test the harness and switch independently.



    Thanks again for taking the time to look at this,

    Ash

  8. #7
    Banned qwerty's Avatar
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    Pulling the wires from the connector will likely ruin the connector. You can test at the terminal in the connector.



    Are you sure you have everything recconected properly after replacing the realy? Did this problem occur before you replaced the relay, after, or when?




  9. #8
    Junior Member adaulton's Avatar
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    Ok. I did test at the terminal in the connector. I get infinite resistance from it to ground whether in neutral or not. Same with the terminal in the connector at the harness.



    I apologize that my original explanation was long-winded and confusing. But I didn't replace the relay.



    I'm pretty sure this problem started immediately after I shorted one or more of the indicator lights (may have even been the neutral.) Everything dimmed but it kept running, and after shutting down and trying to restart, I found I had blown the fuse.



    FYI, I had also just installed a trail tech computer and I can describe what all I did there if you think it could be helpful. But I think it was working after the install because I had it running (in neutral, stand down) while I was messing with the computer. And that's when I accidently knocked the indicator sockets which I had exposed. Don't ask.



    Thanks,

    Ash

  10. #9
    Banned qwerty's Avatar
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    If you have infinite resistance all the time either the switch will not close or the wire is broken between the test point and the switch. Next step would be to access the switch and test it at the point where the wire enters.




  11. #10
    Junior Member adaulton's Avatar
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    Hello,



    Following qwerty's advice, I discovered that it was the neutral switch. I finally got the part in and replaced it. It is working now.



    I wanted to update anyone who was following this and take the time to thank qwerty for all the help he provides to people on this forum. His knowledge of the TW and electrical systems is a tremendous asset to this board. I really appreciate it.



    Thanks Again,

    Ash
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