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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I've been having problems with my TW and suspected the stator. I checked the resistance between the red and brown leads and found none.I ordered a new stator from Caltric and found that there is no resistance between the red and brown on the new unit.I don't want to install it and am now questioning whether or not the source coil is actually bad in my original.

Is there anyone out there who can tell me what their resistance is between brown and red on a bike that works?I know its a big ask but I'm grabbing at straws here.


Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #2
With my new stator having no continuity between brown and red ; does this mean it's defective? Anyone out there?
 

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I ran into this same problem. I did a lot of searching and found an old post, this is how they checked theirs. Try checking the red wire to the metal center and you should get something(I got 720). Then check between the brown and the yellow wires (I got 52). Report back and let us know if this works for you and what #'s you get. The guy stated that the winding's were completely separate and it would be impossible to have resistance between red and brown.
 

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hey oleschool and lyterx

here
http://tw200forum.com/forum/members/slowmod-albums-cdi-baselines-picture8259-tw-cdi-diagram-v1-0.html?
is a simplified wiring diagram for the 88-97 tw cdi and stator with specs.
later years are similar except the 12v power has more wires.

although wound together on the same core, the source coil and 12v coil *should* be discrete, no connection between.

the source coil puts out 100-200volts ac at speed and the 12v coil puts out ~14-18vac at the same time. the 14-18 vac is fed straight to the headlight (tungsten doesn't care if it's ac or dc), and also to the rectifier/regulator which turns it into dc and knocks it back to ~14v for bat charging and stuff.

my '90 has been bleeding some source coil voltage onto the 12v side for at least a year. i noticed it first as hard spiking on the analoqe voltmeter i had intalled next to the speedo. it eventually killed the meter. i thought it was an un-smooth /failing regulator. bought a new one, same. turns out that it was getting up 60vac (no load) spiking into the 12v. hooked up a 12v headlight direct to the 12 output from the coil (no regulator) - getting 30vac at the bulb, even with the high-beam load, which was basiclally the spike that the analogue meter was seeing. pretty bright, but the bulb didn't blow.

have been running it since last fall with the regulator feeding the headlight only, and the battery disconnected from on-board charging to protect it from the spikes, i just charge it in the shop and use the kickstart mostly. want to replace the stator before it fails, but have been hearing of bad stators so would like to get to the bottom of that before spending money and time.

tempted to take the old one out, un-coil and count the windings, buy the wire and rewind.

-

if you have no continuity (make sure you are on a correct range, ie if on the 0-200ohms range you'll get "no resistance" when you measure a 700ohm thing..) between brown and red then yes you have a bad stator, or wire going to it. they get pinched.

if you get good resistance readings off your stator,

a) it might only cack out when hot, or

b) it's something else arsing up your cdi. including bad internal solder joints, which is what got mine. the damn kickstand switch is set up to have to be "on" to tell the relay to allow the cdi to work. prone to intermittantancy. or a relay could be bad. from the diagram linked to above, you can isolate that stuff for *test* purposes. you can also tag in wires and run them out to where you can hook up to a voltmeter taped the dash, and measure things like stator output voltage as you drive. if the bike dies, did the voltage? your pickup coil can fail also.

mind-numbing thread on tw cdi's here.
http://tw200forum.com/forum/technical-help/11545-cdi-baseline-info-wires-waveforms-timings-substitution-3.html

not much external should kill a stator unless the cdi is internally shorting out (unlikely to do that and keep running) or a wire from the stator is partially shorting to ground.

make sure your grounds are good. there is a main junction where the only planned ground from the stator tags into the harness about 6" to the rear of the cdi unit on the bike.

good luck with it

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The part about the headlight has me wondering. When I first got the bike and installed my Vapor speedo, I installed a headlight cutoff switch and also an LED headlight (one of the Cyclops ones). Could there be an issue running the bike without the load on the system that a working headlight creates? I know on some snowmobiles, running without a headlight has been known to screw up electrical parts... but those are two-strokes and don't use DC.
 

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Way back when I first got the bike, Lyterx and I exchanged some PMs over stators. I remember sending him the measurements from my then-new $65 eBay stator. They were, at the time:

Testing the three wires in the white plug: 0.05 ohms... testing each of the three, A to B, B to C and C to A.

Today, the same test gave me 0.6 ohms.

Back then, testing AC on the back of the plug with it reconnected and the bike running, I was showing 6v. Today, I was showing 2.2v.

I didn't do any testing on the red, yellow or brown wires back then. Darnit.

Oh... I also tested resistance across the two wires coming from the pickup coil... 909 ohms. Dunno if that's good or bad.

I'm going to cross-post this over in my Bike Missing thread too.
 

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The part about the headlight has me wondering. When I first got the bike and installed my Vapor speedo, I installed a headlight cutoff switch and also an LED headlight (one of the Cyclops ones). Could there be an issue running the bike without the load on the system that a working headlight creates? I know on some snowmobiles, running without a headlight has been known to screw up electrical parts... but those are two-strokes and don't use DC.
without the headlight load, the regulator has to work harder to keep the voltage down within spec. it does this by internaly shorting to ground, then opening when the voltage drops, repeat several times a second. buffered with capacitators i would think but that's the basic mechanism. a shunt type regulator.

before i figured out it wasn't my problem, i bought an oversized regulator, siloconed the connections, and bolted it on the left frame rail behind the airbox. the regulator could handle way more than the stator could put out if needed so it could've handled headlight disconnection.

an easier fix when disconnectin a headlight is... hook up another headlight bulb somewhere. same load.

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to answer your question, if your 12v output is within specs, the regulator is holding (so far) and not affecting the stator.

if the regulator toasts then there is not enough else to drain off enough power from the stator, so the power starts looking for other ways out, or the energy could just turn into heat and cause failure in the stators which are wound together.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I ran into this same problem. I did a lot of searching and found an old post, this is how they checked theirs. Try checking the red wire to the metal center and you should get something(I got 720). Then check between the brown and the yellow wires (I got 52). Report back and let us know if this works for you and what #'s you get. The guy stated that the winding's were completely separate and it would be impossible to have resistance between red and brown.
I get roughly the same readings as you have listed.Brown to Yellow and red to ground. My bike is a 2000 though. I have a Yamaha Service manual that I've been referring to for the wire colors and resistances.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
hey oleschool and lyterx

here
http://tw200forum.com/forum/members/slowmod-albums-cdi-baselines-picture8259-tw-cdi-diagram-v1-0.html?
is a simplified wiring diagram for the 88-97 tw cdi and stator with specs.
later years are similar except the 12v power has more wires.

although wound together on the same core, the source coil and 12v coil *should* be discrete, no connection between.

the source coil puts out 100-200volts ac at speed and the 12v coil puts out ~14-18vac at the same time. the 14-18 vac is fed straight to the headlight (tungsten doesn't care if it's ac or dc), and also to the rectifier/regulator which turns it into dc and knocks it back to ~14v for bat charging and stuff.

my '90 has been bleeding some source coil voltage onto the 12v side for at least a year. i noticed it first as hard spiking on the analoqe voltmeter i had intalled next to the speedo. it eventually killed the meter. i thought it was an un-smooth /failing regulator. bought a new one, same. turns out that it was getting up 60vac (no load) spiking into the 12v. hooked up a 12v headlight direct to the 12 output from the coil (no regulator) - getting 30vac at the bulb, even with the high-beam load, which was basiclally the spike that the analogue meter was seeing. pretty bright, but the bulb didn't blow.

have been running it since last fall with the regulator feeding the headlight only, and the battery disconnected from on-board charging to protect it from the spikes, i just charge it in the shop and use the kickstart mostly. want to replace the stator before it fails, but have been hearing of bad stators so would like to get to the bottom of that before spending money and time.

tempted to take the old one out, un-coil and count the windings, buy the wire and rewind.

-

if you have no continuity (make sure you are on a correct range, ie if on the 0-200ohms range you'll get "no resistance" when you measure a 700ohm thing..) between brown and red then yes you have a bad stator, or wire going to it. they get pinched.

if you get good resistance readings off your stator,

a) it might only cack out when hot, or

b) it's something else arsing up your cdi. including bad internal solder joints, which is what got mine. the damn kickstand switch is set up to have to be "on" to tell the relay to allow the cdi to work. prone to intermittantancy. or a relay could be bad. from the diagram linked to above, you can isolate that stuff for *test* purposes. you can also tag in wires and run them out to where you can hook up to a voltmeter taped the dash, and measure things like stator output voltage as you drive. if the bike dies, did the voltage? your pickup coil can fail also.

mind-numbing thread on tw cdi's here.
http://tw200forum.com/forum/technical-help/11545-cdi-baseline-info-wires-waveforms-timings-substitution-3.html

not much external should kill a stator unless the cdi is internally shorting out (unlikely to do that and keep running) or a wire from the stator is partially shorting to ground.

make sure your grounds are good. there is a main junction where the only planned ground from the stator tags into the harness about 6" to the rear of the cdi unit on the bike.

good luck with it

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Thanks for this. My bike is a 2000 and I have no continuity between red/brown.My manual says I should have 400-450 ohms.I'm using an auto-ranging Fluke meter and have been able to get the roughly 50 ohms between brown/yellow and the 700 ohms between red/ground simultaneously.I have checked all three sides of the white wires and they are fine.I have not checked the grounds on the bike and will look at them today ,including all of the other switches which will kill the bike.

The original stator was replaced with a Yamaha unit which then died immediately.The bike sat for a few years then I purchased a Caltric unit which arrived with no continuity between red/brown.They are shipping me a replacement and were very good about it but I'm thinking what are the odds???


Thanks for your help
 

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hey oleschool and lyterx

here
http://tw200forum.com/forum/members/slowmod-albums-cdi-baselines-picture8259-tw-cdi-diagram-v1-0.html?
is a simplified wiring diagram for the 88-97 tw cdi and stator with specs.
later years are similar except the 12v power has more wires.

-

if you have no continuity (make sure you are on a correct range, ie if on the 0-200ohms range you'll get "no resistance" when you measure a 700ohm thing..) between brown and red then yes you have a bad stator, or wire going to it. they get pinched.


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looks like that is not the case (fancy way of saying i was wrong). sorry!!

found a diagram for the newer tw's. according to it, the source coils are discrete from each other so there should be no continuity between red and brown.

TW200 Wiring 3phase.jpg

-
 

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Not many forum where folks will come back and say they were wrong and offer another avenue...

Although I do not have an issue with this type of problem I read so I develop knowledge and have bookmarks for data and solutions...

Thank you,

Jim
 

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Yes the replacement came from Caltric and no it did not have continuity between red/brown.
If you read post #12 from slowmod, he explains that the will be no resistance between red/brown. Put it on and it will work if that is your problem. I am returning my 2nd burned up (in 2000 miles) caltric stator for a refund. Good luck and post up your results.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Just checked it.Red to Ground = 685 Ohms and Brown to Yellow = 46 Ohms.The unit is installed and working.It turns out the cdi was defective.Installed a GY6 off of EBay and will see how long it lasts.
 

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hey does anyone know where all the wires coming out of the stator are leading , ive taken all of the electronics off of my tw200 1987 and am creating a scrambler type bike with no battery,or electric start, only kickstart , if anyone has any experience in what im doing help would be appreciated
 
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