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Discussion Starter #1
Have a dink off day...was going to try it...Only problem is that it's 14 degrees...Was going to throw a handful of sidewalk melt in the bucket along with the baking soda...Am I going to create a deadly off gas?

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Discussion Starter #3
what the hell is a "dink off day" ?
Ain't gonna waste the propane and wood to heat the shop on a 16 degree day...going to take care of some minor in the house repairs and such...

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Electrolitic Stripping- Having to do with electrolysis.

I have done quite a bit on antique firearms and old motorcycle parts.

Using a power supply, water, baking soda & a sacrificial piece of steel. I don't know anything about adding sidewalk melt to the witches brew.
What are you stripping?
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Electrolitic Stripping- Having to do with electrolysis.

I have done quite a bit on antique firearms and old motorcycle parts.

Using a power supply, water, baking soda & a sacrificial piece of steel. I don't know anything about adding sidewalk melt to the witches brew.
What are you stripping?
An old rusty set of hoof nippers at the moment for a test...just something I thought might be handy to have in the arsenal around the ranch/farm...water is keeping active enough at 18 degrees to not freeze so far...

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I've done it in the past with old coins using salt(ed) water and a DC power supply. It works reasonably well, but I haven't tried it with larger items.
 

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I have. I'll see if I can find my photo montage. In the meantime, here's what I recall;
I started with a 5 gallon plastic bucket. I cut several sticks of rebar and drilled holes around the top lip of the bucket, then wired the rebar to the inside hanging down into the bucket, reaching the bottom. The wire was stranded copper without insulation. Found that stuff at an arts supply store used for hanging pictures and stuff.
I filled the bucket 3/4 full with water and added Arm&Hammer Super Washing Soda. NOT BAKING SODA! Can't remember how much, a few hand fulls anyways. Mix it in well.
Then I added TSP (Tri-Sodium Phosphate) Can't remember how much, but a handful or more maybe in 5 gallons. More later on as to why I use TSP....
Then I built a rack out of PVC pipe and connectors to suspend my parts over and down into the bucket. No glue needed as the parts fit fairly tight and you may want to disassemble at a later time.
Next I took a rusty part, kickstand I think, and suspended it into the solution by hanging it from the PVC using another length of bare copper stranded wire. I attached a battery charger, a Schumacher SEM-1562A-CA 1.5 Amp Speed Charge Battery Maintainer. Negative to the wire attaching the rebar and positive to the wire attaching the kick stand. At first, nothing, then I added a battery in parallel, observing polarity. Seems the charger was able to auto sense when a battery is attached or not before turning itself on. Once I could see by the LED's on the charger that it was cranking output, I disconnected the battery. Battery was a small 7ah thing used for alarm systems and such.
After a few minutes, I could see bubbles forming on the kickstand and on the rebar. Oxygen on one, Hydrogen gas on the other although I do not recall which is which. I let run over night. Next day the kickstand was clean of rust. I use it now for various metal parts I want to clean like tools or such.
NOTE!!!
One of the best things about doing this with TSP is that the electrolytic action causes the phosphate in the TSP to bind with the iron in the metal part. Just like oxygen combines with iron to form rust in the form of ferrous oxide, FeO2, so does phosphate combine with iron, making ferrous phosphate. Or, in other words RUST! But not rust from oxygen, from phosphate. Rust protects the metal underneath, until it's too deep. In this case the phosphate rust protects the metal from oxygen rusting. The finish is a dull gray metal look and it will never EVER rust to red/brown from oxygen and it will never get any worse looking. Just about all other rust removers expose the metal to future rusting by exposure to air or water. This won't.
Hard to do inside gas tanks as there must be a 'line-of-sight' between the anode and the cathode (positive and negative, part being derusted and rebar). I've hung a small piece of rebar into a tank using this method, with one charger lead on this bar and the other on the tank. Fill the tank with the solution described above and the inside of the tank will be derusted.
HOWEVER
I think there are a couple other methods I've found that work at least as well;
1. Oxalic Acid. Available on Amazon 5 pound bag runs around $15. Mix with water. Safe to use; it's a main ingredient in food preservation. Taste it once mixed and see; will taste like lemon juice. Mild acid. The thing I like about this stuff is doing large parts. I've derusted whole motorcycle frames in my driveway making a frame from 2x12's, lining with 6mil plastic, filling with water and adding acid. Works good in low temps as well. The rust falls off and the water turns from clear to a milky yellow when dissolving the rust.
2. Evapo-Rust. By far and away, the absolute best way to remove rust. It is expensive though, so only for small parts or for parts you can build a tank so you don't use a lot of it. Here's details;
This stuff works like this; it has a molecular structure that attracts to rust, oxidized iron, FeO2, Ferris Oxide. (I mention all that because if you want to understand how this stuff works, you need to understand chemistry.) FeO2 has a shortage of electrons in it's valence shell. This stuff has an extra electron, causing it to bind with the rust. (see how I use different terms for the same thing; rust=FeO2?) Once it's bound, the rust is no longer bound to the Fe and falls away from the body of the part you are derusting. This falls to the bottom of the tank, jar, plastic bucket, rubbermaid container, what ever you are using to hold the part in the liquid. Once it falls off, there are other molecules in the Evapo-Rust which causes the first molecules to release from the FeO2 and be freed up to go get more rust off the parts. No need to stir, this will do it all itself. After a period of time, all the rust is removed and the chemical reaction stops. The part is so whistle clean, you won't believe it. I did several brake arm assemblies for motorcycle drum rear brakes where the spring, washers, threaded rod, etc was so rusted, the individual parts were indistinguishable from each other. After soaking in Evapo-Rust, I could loosen the nut on the threaded rod with my fingers. I built a tank using 1" PVC pipe and a cap on the end so I was able to conserve the amount of Evapo-Rust I needed to use. Simply wiping the product on the part won't due. It must soak for a while. Like TSP, Evapo-Rust leaves a finish on the part that will protect it from oxygen and future rusting. How long it lasts, I don't know since in almost every instance, I protected the raw metal with paint after, or else I wire brushed the metal back to shiny and removed the coating. I later used a clear spray on to prevent the part from future rusting.
3. Vinegar. Apple cider vinegar works best. Not cheap at $7 a gallon or so. Works great inside stuff like gas tanks. However, once cleaned, the part has to be rinsed and dried almost immediately as it will rust very quickly. Like, in mere minutes. Dry the part, wipe with steel wool to remove the rust that will reform, then coat with paint of some sort. Gotta work relatively quick using this stuff.

In these photos;
First is a CT90 gas tank half done, showing rusted and derusted demarcation.
Second shows CT90 front fender. Notice all the tiny bubbles venting off the rebar and the fender. One is oxygen, the other hydrogen gasses.
Third shows CT90 swingarm and the most through photo since it shows the whole set up.

NOTE: do this outdoor or well ventilated area because O2 gas and Hydrogen gas are very flammable. Together they are downright explosive.

CT90project004_zps388351e1.JPG

View attachment 187116

CT90057_zpsce779601.JPG
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I have. I'll see if I can find my photo montage. In the meantime, here's what I recall;
I started with a 5 gallon plastic bucket. I cut several sticks of rebar and drilled holes around the top lip of the bucket, then wired the rebar to the inside hanging down into the bucket, reaching the bottom. The wire was stranded copper without insulation. Found that stuff at an arts supply store used for hanging pictures and stuff.
I filled the bucket 3/4 full with water and added Arm&Hammer Super Washing Soda. NOT BAKING SODA! Can't remember how much, a few hand fulls anyways. Mix it in well.
Then I added TSP (Tri-Sodium Phosphate) Can't remember how much, but a handful or more maybe in 5 gallons. More later on as to why I use TSP....
Then I built a rack out of PVC pipe and connectors to suspend my parts over and down into the bucket. No glue needed as the parts fit fairly tight and you may want to disassemble at a later time.
Next I took a rusty part, kickstand I think, and suspended it into the solution by hanging it from the PVC using another length of bare copper stranded wire. I attached a battery charger, a Schumacher SEM-1562A-CA 1.5 Amp Speed Charge Battery Maintainer. Negative to the wire attaching the rebar and positive to the wire attaching the kick stand. At first, nothing, then I added a battery in parallel, observing polarity. Seems the charger was able to auto sense when a battery is attached or not before turning itself on. Once I could see by the LED's on the charger that it was cranking output, I disconnected the battery. Battery was a small 7ah thing used for alarm systems and such.
After a few minutes, I could see bubbles forming on the kickstand and on the rebar. Oxygen on one, Hydrogen gas on the other although I do not recall which is which. I let run over night. Next day the kickstand was clean of rust. I use it now for various metal parts I want to clean like tools or such.
NOTE!!!
One of the best things about doing this with TSP is that the electrolytic action causes the phosphate in the TSP to bind with the iron in the metal part. Just like oxygen combines with iron to form rust in the form of ferrous oxide, FeO2, so does phosphate combine with iron, making ferrous phosphate. Or, in other words RUST! But not rust from oxygen, from phosphate. Rust protects the metal underneath, until it's too deep. In this case the phosphate rust protects the metal from oxygen rusting. The finish is a dull gray metal look and it will never EVER rust to red/brown from oxygen and it will never get any worse looking. Just about all other rust removers expose the metal to future rusting by exposure to air or water. This won't.
HOWEVER
I think there are a couple other methods I've found that work at least as well;
1. Oxalic Acid. Available on Amazon 5 pound bag runs around $15. Mix with water. Safe to use; it's a main ingredient in food preservation. Taste it once mixed and see; will taste like lemon juice. Mild acid. The thing I like about this stuff is doing large parts. I've derusted whole motorcycle frames in my driveway making a frame from 2x12's, lining with 6mil plastic, filling with water and adding acid. Works good in low temps as well. The rust falls off and the water turns from clear to a milky yellow when dissolving the rust.
2. Evapo-Rust. By far and away, the absolute best way to remove rust. It is expensive though, so only for small parts or for parts you can build a tank so you don't use a lot of it. Here's details;
This stuff works like this; it has a molecular structure that attracts to rust, oxidized iron, FeO2, Ferris Oxide. (I mention all that because if you want to understand how this stuff works, you need to understand chemistry.) FeO2 has a shortage of electrons in it's valence shell. This stuff has an extra electron, causing it to bind with the rust. (see how I use different terms for the same thing; rust=FeO2?) Once it's bound, the rust is no longer bound to the Fe and falls away from the body of the part you are derusting. This falls to the bottom of the tank, jar, plastic bucket, rubbermaid container, what ever you are using to hold the part in the liquid. Once it falls off, there are other molecules in the Evapo-Rust which causes the first molecules to release from the FeO2 and be freed up to go get more rust off the parts. No need to stir, this will do it all itself. After a period of time, all the rust is removed and the chemical reaction stops. The part is so whistle clean, you won't believe it. I did several brake arm assemblies for motorcycle drum rear brakes where the spring, washers, threaded rod, etc was so rusted, the individual parts were indistinguishable from each other. After soaking in Evapo-Rust, I could loosen the nut on the threaded rod with my fingers. I built a tank using 1" PVC pipe and a cap on the end so I was able to conserve the amount of Evapo-Rust I needed to use. Simply wiping the product on the part won't due. It must soak for a while. Like TSP, Evapo-Rust leaves a finish on the part that will protect it from oxygen and future rusting. How long it lasts, I don't know since in almost every instance, I protected the raw metal with paint after, or else I wire brushed the metal back to shiny and removed the coating. I later used a clear spray on to prevent the part from future rusting.
3. Vinegar. Apple cider vinegar works best. Not cheap at $7 a gallon or so. Works great inside stuff like gas tanks. However, once cleaned, the part has to be rinsed and dried almost immediately as it will rust very quickly. Like, in mere minutes. Dry the part, wipe with steel wool to remove the rust that will reform, then coat with paint of some sort. Gotta work relatively quick using this stuff.
Very good read Ski Pro!!!!

As I mentioned before, just something else to add to the arsenal around here...A ranch/farm produces rusty stuff...Plus I like to recycle stuff...for crafty kind of things...

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Hey, Ski...excellent write up!
This will be very useful info, I have tons of old tools I would like to reclaim. Not to use, but to produce better looking "barn art".
Thanks very much for your time in posting this!

Question:
In the options where the parts are hung by stranded copper wires, does it matter if the parts are touching?
If it does NOT matter, would it work to use only a few wires for many parts?
I don't think this would work but wanted to ask.
 

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Added photos.
As far as multiple parts, as long as you understand this whole assembly is basically a battery you are charging. The rods are positive plates, the parts are negative plates, the soda/TSP solution the electrolyte and the charger of course, supplying the current. Just like any battery during charge, the plates will gas. If you see tiny bubbles coming off the part, it's working. If not, adjust wires, parts for effect.
 

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Love the wok!!
At many of the kayak fishing tournaments, a guy builds these for the raffle as a prize. Very cool! I use a very large version of that one you show for cooking up breakfast burrito stuffing when I work at HOW events.
HOW stands for Heros On the Water, where we take disabled vets and families out kayak fishing. We host them with foil wrapped breakfast burritos on their way out on the water, then some other dish cooked in the wok for lunch.

For a part like that, I'd use Oxalic Acid. It's safe for food stuff and you should easily be able to build a frame tank out of wood and plastic. I use the left over acid mix on my hydrangeas. They love acid and iron! I've also used it on my lawn but water it down a bit more before spraying it around. Yes, it's just that safe.

After derusting, I'd throw it on the burner, add bacon fat and season it good. Maybe 3 or 4 times season it good, wiping down between each seasoning. Don't burn but get it hot enough to smoke. I use an orbital sander to get a smooth finish first. Especially on cast iron. Final patina should be almost black. If you choose not to season, or to clean down to bare metal between uses, wipe down with olive or coconut oil before storing. Then, when you get ready to cook, heat up and cook off the oil, start with a hot wok. But if you cook with a wok, you know it's gotta be HOT. Ha!

****EDIT****
Where in Idaho are you? I have family in Boise we visit regularly. I'd love to come steal that wok. Ha!
 

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I've recovered axe heads, splitting wedges, sledge hammers from our fire years ago. I pulled them out before everything was hauled away and they sat for many years. A few runs through the tank and they were clean enough to paint and put new handles on. None the worse for the wear.
 

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Thanks for the explanation.
And thank you so very much for that great work with the Vets and their families...I know they must love it. And you!

Added photos.
As far as multiple parts, as long as you understand this whole assembly is basically a battery you are charging. The rods are positive plates, the parts are negative plates, the soda/TSP solution the electrolyte and the charger of course, supplying the current. Just like any battery during charge, the plates will gas. If you see tiny bubbles coming off the part, it's working. If not, adjust wires, parts for effect.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Love the wok!!
At many of the kayak fishing tournaments, a guy builds these for the raffle as a prize. Very cool! I use a very large version of that one you show for cooking up breakfast burrito stuffing when I work at HOW events.
HOW stands for Heros On the Water, where we take disabled vets and families out kayak fishing. We host them with foil wrapped breakfast burritos on their way out on the water, then some other dish cooked in the wok for lunch.

For a part like that, I'd use Oxalic Acid. It's safe for food stuff and you should easily be able to build a frame tank out of wood and plastic. I use the left over acid mix on my hydrangeas. They love acid and iron! I've also used it on my lawn but water it down a bit more before spraying it around. Yes, it's just that safe.

After derusting, I'd throw it on the burner, add bacon fat and season it good. Maybe 3 or 4 times season it good, wiping down between each seasoning. Don't burn but get it hot enough to smoke. I use an orbital sander to get a smooth finish first. Especially on cast iron. Final patina should be almost black. If you choose not to season, or to clean down to bare metal between uses, wipe down with olive or coconut oil before storing. Then, when you get ready to cook, heat up and cook off the oil, start with a hot wok. But if you cook with a wok, you know it's gotta be HOT. Ha!

****EDIT****
Where in Idaho are you? I have family in Boise we visit regularly. I'd love to come steal that wok. Ha!
Hour and a half East on I84...Jerome...and the pics were the seasoning part...

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Someone tell me if this worked posting this photo.
This is at a HOW event. The chair belongs to a woman nurse who lost use of both legs in an IED in Iraq. She took some convincing to get into the kayak, but later, they had to radio me to get us to come in as the bus was wanting to leave. She really, REALLY didn't want to go!





Honest to God, this is one of the volunteers. He's got a Webber grill on his kayak and would prepare and cook your fish right on the lake while you waited! Love our VETS!


A couple more photos;
This was on an overnight camp out with the vets. This guy didn't want to give up and finally landed a fish right at sunset;


All the rods are rigged and ready for our vets to give fishin' a go!


This guy has been in a VA hospital since he returned from Vietnam. No family to visit him and no friends outside the hospital. At first he didn't want to fish, so I just took him on a kayak tour of the lake. We stopped in some reeds to rest and I asked if I could toss a lure as we chatted. I caught a bass first cast and he asked, if the fishing was that easy, could he give it a go. I stashed a rod as I knew this might happen. He couldn't fish from the kayak so we got out and waded while fishing. He told me he hadn't fished since he was a boy growing up in Puerto Rico with his mom. He was another one who refused to come in for lunch and later to get on the bus. Breaks my heart for these vets to see them warehoused in a hospital when he can obviously get out and fish!
 

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Rusted and hanging/accessory hardware for some rare 3rd party BMW "Enduro" Bags. 1960's crude & rude primitive construction. They make much, much nicer and better replica's now but... they are replicas. Having all the original pieces is like Hen's Teeth for a /2 owner:

IMG_8436.jpg

IMG_8438.jpg

IMG_8437.jpg

IMG_8434.jpg

IMG_8435.jpg

I had to scratch-off a couple of the tiny aluminum parts. This only works on steel/steel based metals. But came out excellent and after etching primer and triple painting looked probably better than when it was sold new. I could never get it this clean down to bare metal sanding or stripping with a chemical stripper.

IMG_8578.jpg

IMG_8581.jpg
 

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I thought you were doing that for a hair problem...? :)

Rusted and hanging/accessory hardware for some rare 3rd party BMW "Enduro" Bags. 1960's crude & rude primitive construction. They make much, much nicer and better replica's now but... they are replicas. Having all the original pieces is like Hen's Teeth for a /2 owner:

View attachment 187120

View attachment 187122

View attachment 187124

View attachment 187126

View attachment 187128

I had to scratch-off a couple of the tiny aluminum parts. This only works on steel/steel based metals. But came out excellent and after etching primer and triple painting looked probably better than when it was sold new. I could never get it this clean down to bare metal sanding or stripping with a chemical stripper.

View attachment 187130

View attachment 187132
 
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