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Discussion Starter #1
Whats in your wallet....I mean gas tank?

Which is better and why?

I've used MMO and was very surprized at how well it worked in keeping the engine clean.

I'm thinking about trying it in the crankcase oil too.

However last night I used Sea Foam when my bike was sputtering so bad I didn't think I'd make it home.

This morning the bike feels like a brand new bike!

Can they both be used at the same time? Or is one better than the other?

Let the comments begin.
 

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I can't say which is better because I haven't used MMO. Some mechanics I know use MMO during the break-in of rebuilt small aircraft engines (Lycoming and Continental).



As for Seafoam, I've been using it since the late 1960's (eeek! I can't be that old!). I started using it to decarbon 2 cycle outboard engines. It worked.



Then when I got into motorcycles, I started using Seafoam to clean up carburetors of bikes that had been sitting unused for months or years. Anything was worth a try to prevent having to disassemble a 4 carb setup. Again, it worked.



There are a multitude of carb cleaning products but I haven't found one that works better. I have also come across some naysayers as to the effectiveness of Seafoam, but not many.



Until I find something better, I'll stick with the Seafoam when needed.



jb
 

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I can't say which is better because I haven't used MMO. Some mechanics I know use MMO during the break-in of rebuilt small aircraft engines (Lycoming and Continental).



As for Seafoam, I've been using it since the late 1960's (eeek! I can't be that old!). I started using it to decarbon 2 cycle outboard engines. It worked.



Then when I got into motorcycles, I started using Seafoam to clean up carburetors of bikes that had been sitting unused for months or years. Anything was worth a try to prevent having to disassemble a 4 carb setup. Again, it worked.



There are a multitude of carb cleaning products but I haven't found one that works better. I have also come across some naysayers as to the effectiveness of Seafoam, but not many.



Until I find something better, I'll stick with the Seafoam when needed.



jb




I have been using marvel misery oil for many years. Half an ounce to about three gallons of gas now and then keeps a carb working well and assists as an upper cylinder lubricant.

In the shop I keep a hypodermic syringe with a 22gauge needle to apply a very small drop where needed on small machine parts without over oiling into a mess. It can be injected down cable jackets for throttle and clutch and braking cables. It works very well as a cutting oil and has great penetrating qualities. It smells nice but don't cook with it.

I think the nice smell is oil of wintergreen, this could account for its penetrating ability too. As a general purpose shop lubricant, I mix MO with motor oil about half and half.

It is altogether a very handy stuff to have in your garage.



sea foam is for carbs or water in the gas.



Phelonius
 

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Even though they are two very different formulas, they do much of the same things.



I use them both in all my engines; car, motorcycle, lawn mower, weed-whacker. I believe MMO is a bit better at lubricating, while Sea Foam is a bit better at cleaning varnish out. They both stabilize fuel.



They don't interfere with each other, and work well to keep everything lubed & clean. Used according to instructions they have no affect on performance (other than making the engine run smooth & efficient). I never have any trouble starting my mower or weed-whacker in the spring after months of sitting. And when I get into any of the engines, they don't show anywhere near the wear they would normally have for their age/hours.



Having started driving/riding/mowing my own vehicles in 1978, I have three decades of experience with these products. I'd recommend using both.



Very important note: If you get a brand new engine, don't use MMO until after the break in period. It chemically bonds with the metal and changes the wear characteristics. You want the engine to wear normally until everything is seated well. I got this info from the old farmers here in the heartland.

 

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...

Very important note: If you get a brand new engine, don't use MMO until after the break in period. It chemically bonds with the metal and changes the wear characteristics. You want the engine to wear normally until everything is seated well. I got this info from the old farmers here in the heartland.
SRS,



I'm not disagreeing with you, just wondering why those old timer mechanics that rebuild small aircraft engines use MMO during the break-in, and not after.



Nevermind...... I checked on an aviation engineering forum, and found MMO is not FAA approved for use in aircraft engines.



Also, the use of MMO is a controversial topic on those forums. Some swear by it, and others don't.



Kind of like a "which is the best oil" thread... not likely to convince anyone either way.



jb
 

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SRS,



I'm not disagreeing with you, just wondering why those old timer mechanics that rebuild small aircraft engines use MMO during the break-in, and not after.



Nevermind...... I checked on an aviation engineering forum, and found MMO is not FAA approved for use in aircraft engines.



Also, the use of MMO is a controversial topic on those forums. Some swear by it, and others don't.



Kind of like a "which is the best oil" thread... not likely to convince anyone either way.



jb


Here's my 2¢:



An aircraft engine would be (hopefully) built to more exacting standards, and high tolerances. You would want to keep as much of that intact as possible during break-in.



Most automotive, and farm equipment engines (at least back in the day) are engineered with break-in wear allowed for. It lets the factory crank them out faster.



The thing with MMO is that it actually soaks into the metal and changes it permanently. Out of curiosity I have cut metal that had MMO used on it and seen for myself how far in the reddish tint goes beneath the surface. It is actually an engine lubricating "treatment".



The debate between use or not during break-in is a question of how much you want the parts to wear into each other before "freezing" or slowing the wear. MMO will change the wear characteristics enough to make a big difference. The decision will depend on how the engine is put together.



I've seen the results myself. I bought an '80 XS850 Yamaha new in '79. Drove it 400 miles the first week, and then went from Kansas to Michigan in 24 hours (80+mph), having a shop outside Chicago do the first service. Then started using MMO at the next oil change. And years later at 130,000 miles it looked almost new inside when I had to pull it apart. MMO lubricates very well.



And as with driving techniques for break-in, there are going to be people who swear by different methods. Such as, I believe in breaking in an engine as you intend to drive it. Others will argue for RPM changes, and no loading, and on, and on.



Thinking it over... some modern engines, made with higher tolerances might do better with MMO during break-in. So I guess it will be an engine by engine decision each time I buy something new.

 

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SRS,



Thanks. I appreciate your thoughts and point of view on MMO.



jb
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Here's my 2¢:



An aircraft engine would be (hopefully) built to more exacting standards, and high tolerances. You would want to keep as much of that intact as possible during break-in.



Most automotive, and farm equipment engines (at least back in the day) are engineered with break-in wear allowed for. It lets the factory crank them out faster.



The thing with MMO is that it actually soaks into the metal and changes it permanently. Out of curiosity I have cut metal that had MMO used on it and seen for myself how far in the reddish tint goes beneath the surface. It is actually an engine lubricating "treatment".



The debate between use or not during break-in is a question of how much you want the parts to wear into each other before "freezing" or slowing the wear. MMO will change the wear characteristics enough to make a big difference. The decision will depend on how the engine is put together.



I've seen the results myself. I bought an '80 XS850 Yamaha new in '79. Drove it 400 miles the first week, and then went from Kansas to Michigan in 24 hours (80+mph), having a shop outside Chicago do the first service. Then started using MMO at the next oil change. And years later at 130,000 miles it looked almost new inside when I had to pull it apart. MMO lubricates very well.



And as with driving techniques for break-in, there are going to be people who swear by different methods. Such as, I believe in breaking in an engine as you intend to drive it. Others will argue for RPM changes, and no loading, and on, and on.



Thinking it over... some modern engines, made with higher tolerances might do better with MMO during break-in. So I guess it will be an engine by engine decision each time I buy something new.


SRS713, thank you for sharing your results with us. A question for you, Did you use the MMO in the gas tank or in the crankcase or both on your xs850? I'm almost ready to do another oil change and am considering trying it in the crankcase this time. I'm just worried about the poor quality of the basegaskets and prone to leakage. any suggestions?

Thanks for sharking.
 

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SRS713, thank you for sharing your results with us. A question for you, Did you use the MMO in the gas tank or in the crankcase or both on your xs850? I'm almost ready to do another oil change and am considering trying it in the crankcase this time. I'm just worried about the poor quality of the basegaskets and prone to leakage. any suggestions?

Thanks for sharking.


Sorry to take so long replying, I was focusing on a job interview out of state.



I use MMO in both the fuel and the oil, following the directions on the container. I also put some in the drive shaft gear boxes of the 850, but that doesn't concern a TW owner.




I don't think it will change the condition of the base gasket. If it's going to leak, MMO won't stop it, if it's not gonna leak, MMO won't make it leak.



75% of my vehicles have been bought used, I've never had any of those engines start leaking because of adding MMO.

 

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Discussion Starter #10
Sorry to take so long replying, I was focusing on a job interview out of state.



I use MMO in both the fuel and the oil, following the directions on the container. I also put some in the drive shaft gear boxes of the 850, but that doesn't concern a TW owner.




I don't think it will change the condition of the base gasket. If it's going to leak, MMO won't stop it, if it's not gonna leak, MMO won't make it leak.



75% of my vehicles have been bought used, I've never had any of those engines start leaking because of adding MMO.




Thanks for taking the time to reply. Hope you got the job!

I'm going to try it this next oil change. In the engine, I'll add my 1qt of oil, then top it off with 6 oz of MMO

as you suggested.

How much MMO (oz's) per gallon of fuel do you use. The seafoam, I use 1oz per gallon. Do I do the same?

Thanks again.
 

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I got the job. Just have to pass a background check and drug test. I'll be riding in Georgia from now on. And I hope to get down to the Florida Keys next summer.



The instructions for MMO and SeaFoam say to use about the same amounts. Sometimes I just eyeball it for the fuel tank, pouring in what looks right. After having measured so often you get to know how long it takes to pour that amount out of the bottles. A little extra or a little less won't hurt anything. At most if you get too much in, MPG will drop a point or two and the exhaust will smell strange.



 

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I've almost always have a bottle of each in my garage. I love them both




Mix them together and make Mystery Foam





[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRAV5ln5cUc&feature=related[/media]



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X30hiZZyl-Y&feature=related[/media]
 

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I never have any trouble starting my mower or weed-whacker in the spring after months of sitting.


I know this is an older post, but I thought I would share a little of my experience with Marvel Mystery Oil...thus far. Now, I'm not giving preference to MMO over Seafoam, it's just that MMO is what I decided to use. Sounds like both products work just fine.



Pre-MMO experience. Summer, no issues with starting the TW. Winter, hard to start while sitting as little as a week, sometimes having to crank, and crank with no luck starting eventually killing the battery to the point where the engine wouldn't turn over anymore. Then I had to jump start the TW. Still hard to start, but finally will get it going.



Then after reading this thread, I decided to give MMO a try. Looked safe after reading the posts.



I did put MMO in the engine during my last oil change right before my Bender Creek ride. Quite honestly I don't think I will notice anything until I would have to tear the engine down, which I hope I don't have to do.



I also put some in my gas. To my surprise, the engine fires right up every time, even after sitting for a few weeks. I was really surprised by this. So I just thought I would share my experience.

 

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Discussion Starter #14
I know this is an older post, but I thought I would share a little of my experience with Marvel Mystery Oil...thus far. Now, I'm not giving preference to MMO over Seafoam, it's just that MMO is what I decided to use. Sounds like both products work just fine.



Pre-MMO experience. Summer, no issues with starting the TW. Winter, hard to start while sitting as little as a week, sometimes having to crank, and crank with no luck starting eventually killing the battery to the point where the engine wouldn't turn over anymore. Then I had to jump start the TW. Still hard to start, but finally will get it going.



Then after reading this thread, I decided to give MMO a try. Looked safe after reading the posts.



I did put MMO in the engine during my last oil change right before my Bender Creek ride. Quite honestly I don't think I will notice anything until I would have to tear the engine down, which I hope I don't have to do.



I also put some in my gas. To my surprise, the engine fires right up every time, even after sitting for a few weeks. I was really surprised by this. So I just thought I would share my experience.




Admiral,

How much MMO did you add to the fuel tank and the engine oil.

The instructions on sea foam say 4oz to 10gal, which is similar to the MMO

With Seafoam I use 1oz per gal for cleaning.

With MMO I use 1/2oz per gal at every fill up.

NOTE: If anyone in your family ever uses the 5 hour energy drink, save the bottles!

They hold exactly 2oz, and you can see the faint red color through the white plastic.

They don't leak and are easy to carry when out riding or traveling. I've got a whole stash of them now.

The labels peel off pretty easy.

Ride safe
 

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i like the energy drink bottle idea. im always looking for inventive ways to store things on the bike and that could probably be squeezed in with the factory tool pouch.



thanks shawn
 

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Discussion Starter #16
i like the energy drink bottle idea. im always looking for inventive ways to store things on the bike and that could probably be squeezed in with the factory tool pouch.



thanks shawn




I picked up a small black nylon sony camera case as wally world for about $10

Its large enough for a camera, duh, and has a pocket on the outside for cell phone or ID.

The best part is it has a really strong, one way snap loop on the back.

I use this on the crossbrace on my handlebars.

Sometimes its my camera, sometimes its the phone/ID, sometimes 2 bottles of MMO,

blue shop towels and a set of blue rubber gloves!

I'm thinking about attaching 2 or 3 of them to each bike.
 

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I've always wondered why auto stores didn't have little Ounce measuring cups. I like this idea a lot. Prior to reading about it here, I discoverd (duh) that a shot glass would work just fine - only for measuring purposes, for adding my Seafoam. I will purchase another energy drink bottle; I actually use one for my "emergency oil" that I keep in my camel pack.



As far as Seafoam....I am a big fan and have been using it pretty much since I was 16 and tinkering around with engines, cars and bikes. I have yet to try the M.M.O. but, after reading the opinions of others here, I shall try it in my Subaru.



Seafoam is great though. Never have I prepped a bike for the winter months - completely. I just add a little more than required Seafoam to the gas and perhaps just a shot within the engine and let it circulate through the system with a running of about 15 minutes. I've never had difficulty firing my motorcycles up in spring....although, they usually don't sit for more than a month at a time...



Off to get some energy and mystery oil!

-Adam
 

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I have used seafoam in my CT's for years. It works great on bikes that have sat with fuel for sometime.
 

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MMO is made of



Naphthenic Hydrocarbons 70 – 80% Naptha.

Mineral Spirits 20 – 30% A solvent and light lubricant clear or light in color derived from petroleum, a cheap pale oil.

Chlorinated Hydrocarbons 0 – 1% Pesticide. Highly toxic. Increase the miscibility of various petroleum derivatives.



SeaFoam is made of

Pale Oil 40.00 - 60.00% A lubricating oil that is light in color that is refined from petroleum.

Naphtha 25.00 - 35.00% A colorless to reddish-brown volatile aromatic liquid, very similar to gasoline, refined from petroleum or coal tar.

IPA 67-63-0 10.00 - 20.00% Isopropyl alcohol miscible in petroleum derivatives that remains miscible when contaminated with water.



The first two listed components of each are about the same. MMO does not possess the water removal properties of SF. I don't relish the thought of exposing myself to pesticide of any description. Therefore, my opinion is that SF is a better product for treating gasoline.



That said, if you run E0 and ride often enough to burn a tank every 3 months, using either as a fuel treatment is a waste of money.



Pri-G is made of



Shellsol D60 35-45% Mineral spirits.

Mixture of amines 5-35% Organic molecules derived from ammonia. Highly reactive

Organic Dispersants 5-35% Improve miscibility of other components.



Seems Pri-G is a severe envronmental threat and lacks the active ingredients of the others.
 
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