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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Recently bought a 2007 TW and the guy said the clutch was slipping a bit when cold (but fine when hot) so I thought I'd just replace the clutch friction and metal plates. I ordered new OEM Yamaha plates from Rocky Mountain ATV*MC (where I pretty much buy all my MC parts from) and I noticed the new metal plates look different than the old ones, new ones aren't symmetrical. The parts fiche says "336-16324-00-00 (replaces part #137-16324-00-00)" so I'm wondering two things, are these plates a newer version that are physically different and if so how are they installed (orientation...)?

Here are pics of the plates:

Original:
IMG_0161.JPG

New:
IMG_0160.JPG

****************************************************************

EDIT:

To avoid having to scroll through the multiple pages for an answer, the answer to my questions were eventually provided by Yamaha USA.

Me: What is the correct orientation for the new design plates?
Yamaha USA: Thank you for reaching out to us. These clutch plates should be offset as shown in the image below:
plate.png

Me: Any idea what the purpose of the nubs are?
Yamaha USA: This shape allows more oil to enter between the clutch plates to improve lubrication. Thank you for your inquiry.

So to sum it up, after installing the first of 5 friction plates in the clutch basket, the first steel plate would be oriented with 'nub' at 12 o'clock position (as shown in image below) then a friction plate then another steel plate with 'nub' at 3 o'clock and so on for all 5 friction plates and 4 steel plates.
tw200_clutch.JPG
 

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Are they all that way? I’ve never had to do a TW clutch but that strikes me as a defect.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Are they all that way? I’ve never had to do a TW clutch but that strikes me as a defect.
Yes, all 4 are that way. If you google either the original part number or the superseded one you'll see multiple listings on Amazon and various MC parts suppliers that reference them as the correct clutch plate for the TW and other Yamaha models, and show the one with the 'nub' on one side. I can't find any web reference to questions or installation. Since there are 4 of them I would think the correct way to install would be to orient the 'nub' 90 degrees from each other simply for balancing purposes.
 

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Thes e are the low speed eccentric torque optimizer plates. They are meant to be aligned together at the nub when oriented this way there is a “flywheel” effect that increases torque for low speed crawling. JK
 

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:D yes.sounds good though. Or they could be the crankshaft resonance balancer plates for less vibration at top speed.
 

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:D yes.sounds good though. Or they could be the crankshaft resonance balancer plates for less vibration at top speed.
When I first read it I was convinced, you sold me. But then I thought about it for a minute........and I came to the conclusion "NO WAY!" However the "resonance balancer for the crankshaft" sounds like a really good idea.
 

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There not for prying up pull tabs on beer cans then?
Sure Fred they would work for that but kinda hard to get at unless you carry a spare.

Seriously though azgsa those are certainly different plates and your assumption to install opposing makes sense. However I think the question needs to be answered by Yamaha. I would call them directly or email may be best with pics. Let us know what the answer is I am intrigued.These new clutch plates may be the biggest secret improvement to the TW in 30 years. Yamaha engineers usually have a good reason if they make changes.
 

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azgsa

Hey Bro, sorry you're not getting any help...pretty unusual for this forum.
If I knew I'd give it to you straight.

There is a TW forum on FaceBook, try there...good luck!
 

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DArth I don’t think anyone has the answer to his question. And I was just having some fun, but I did make a serious reply and suggestion.
 

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First, without seeing the friction plates, I'm just going to put it out there that there's nothing wrong with your stock plates. The issue with TW clutch slip is with the pressure springs. Aftermarket, stiffer springs will go a long ways to making the clutch not only engage right, but actually give you some range of clutch slippage. Weak springs are manifested in a slipping clutch and a sort of on/off feel at the lever.

Then I'd send those plates they pawned off on you back. I've looked at a lot of clutch plates and I've never seen anything like that before.


****EDIT****
O.K. I took a REAL close look at your plate. That's just messed up! I think that tab is flush with the outer circle of the plate, meaning the plate doesn't have a tab or nipple on it's outer rim, but instead some material is missing on the left and right side of that area, Basically, it's a plate that has less overall surface area, removed on ether side of that tab.
I don't care what the dealer or Yamaha says, I've never seen anything like that and I want original plates. That's just me.

Click on photo to view larger. Click on it again to zoom. I added two black rings to show the area between them that is missing material.

clutch plate.png
 

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Barnett clutch springs on eBay under $16 a set shipped.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1987-2019-YAMAHA-TW200-BARNETT-CLUTCH-SPRINGS-501-47-04044/263993413650?hash=item3d773bd012:g:9B8AAOSw831bxldJ:rk:4:pf:0

EBC springs $11 shipped;
https://www.ebay.com/itm/EBC-CSK-Clutch-Springs-CSK149-Yamaha-TW200-XT225-TTR230-TTR225-Big-Wheel-TT225/312376727908?fits=Model:TW200&epid=171225559&hash=item48bb1a9964:g:4DQAAOSw-yJcEpTL:rk:6:pf:0

I replaced mine with Vesrah heavy duty off eBay for about $10 shipped.

Probably the most important aspect of the job is the side cover gasket. Get a good one and prep the surfaces well before battening everything back down.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
I don't care what the dealer or Yamaha says, I've never seen anything like that and I want original plates. That's just me.

Click on photo to view larger. Click on it again to zoom. I added two black rings to show the area between them that is missing material.

View attachment 187500
Yes, the lack of material was my reasoning for thinking orienting them each at 90 degrees from each other might be right due to weight. Of course, it was just a guess on my part and this thread was my effort to try and find experience with the new plate design and orientation, after trying to find answers via web searches. On a side note, because of the clutch basket design they can't be oriented at 90 degrees anyway. The 3 and 9 o'clock available positions are more like 80 or 100 degrees due to notch locations.

So here's the deal. 'Original' plates from Yamaha are no longer available. These are the superseded parts that are now only available if anyone orders Yamaha OEM parts to rebuild their clutch. I don't know when but at some point Yamaha engineers changed the design, for some reason. I'm a retired software engineer, not a mechanical one and in any case the reason for the design change isn't apparent to me. I'm guessing if an owner of a recent (2016-19?) TW, after this design change was implemented, examined the clutch on their bike they would discover these new plates and their factory orientation in the basket.

Thanks for those who have contributed so far to the thread. I already have Vesrah heavier springs (via eBay) and gasket ready for the reassembly. I wanted OEM clutch plates (friction, steel) which was the reason for the Yamaha OEM order and not EBC or Barnett etc. The original metal plates are probably OK after examination, but new ones are a small price to pay for me when rebuilding it and now I have the 'new design' so would like to use them (again, the original reason for this thread). I don't know what kind of oil the previous owner used but after experiencing clutch slip issues on previous bikes after using non-wet clutch specific oil I only use specific oil on my wet clutch bikes now for some years, my point being perhaps the previous owner used auto oil. I asked him, for that reason, and he said he used Yamalube but whatever, my mom was the only person I ever trusted 100%. ;)

About the same time I started this thread I scoured the web for a Yamaha technical email address and only found phone numbers for Yamaha USA. I don't really want to spend time on that expedition. Guessing those 'in the know' here on this forum probably have older TW's which would likely eliminate exposure to the new plate design (apparently at least so far in this thread anyway). My next step is talking to a local LARGE dealer service team to see if they've ever seen anything like this. In addition, if anyone has a Yamaha technical contact email address perhaps they can ping them or provide contact details.

Cheers :)

EDIT: I messaged Yamaha USA on Facebook to see if they can answer...
 

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I would like to see what's in the later model TW's for clutch plates as well. I can't say definitively, but I am pretty sure I've never seen the plate issue you've brought up on this forum. Probably why there hasn't been much discussion on the matter. I'd be interested in opinions as to why the plates were redesigned to what you show us.
When you ask Yamaha folks questions, ask them if it matters which way that nub is oriented. Either to the basket or to each other. I would seriously think that would cause an out-of-balance condition and either felt or hard on bearings or both. Driven right off the crank, that thing is spinning at many thousands of RPM's.
Have a camera ready when you test fire it up in movie mode.
Cheers indeed!
 

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AzgsaI know it is a pain to find out why the change was made but I am glad you started this thread. I like your idea to contact a large dealer service department they will have quicker access to run down why the change was made and what is the correct way to install the plates. There must be a service bulletin related to this.

Anyone with a 2016 or newer TW have you done any work on the clutch to help with this info?
 

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Put the old metal plates back, with a new set of cork (friction) plates – those metal plates have obviously got a manufacturing error. It’s normally the cork plates that wear anyway, the metal plates are good for a very long time (the other point of possible wear is the springs)

Double check the oil you are using is OK for wet multi-plate clutches, and go for 10/40W

Chances are the last guy put the wrong oil in there, which contaminated the cork plates ….
 

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+1 for stiffer springs. Yamaha's dating to the 80's were famous for marginal clutch springs and premature clutch wear. If you do anything to hop up the power a bit- even simple bolt ons, or up the gearing, slipping was usually not too far behind. Couple that with the super-secret squirrel magic synthetic oils made out of Teflon mixed with KY people love to use now that make the clutch's job even harder, and yeah, slippage is pretty common on these older bikes.

Both my TW's clutches started to slip not too long after the cam/piston. The second one (which I'm running 15/47 gearing) developed it a lot sooner than the first one, which had an ATV tire and 13/50 gears, but both were slipping before 4000 miles when going WOT in fifth gear. Both just got aftermarket springs and the issue vanished. The steels and frictions looked perfectly fine and were reused in both cases. I think the first one I used the Barnett springs and this one I got the Vesrah, no particular reason, it was a couple bucks cheaper. Both resulted in a slightly stiffer clutch lever, but that's to be expected, and both eliminated the slippage.
 
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