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Discussion Starter #1
I'm beginning to think I should consider turning at least one of my AgriSupply tubes I've mounted on my TW into a "Survival Kit." Here's a link to a site where it discusses making a kit small enough to fit into an Altoids tin ((Altoid Tin Kit). I'm a little baffled though as they go into lots of stuff that surely wouldn't all fit into such a tin.



The tube however could fit quite a bit of stuff. Have you made such a kit for your TW and if so, what does it have in it?
 

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I wear a Survival Sack, Bug-Out-Bag, Scram Sack, Ditch Bag. I call mine a "Bug-out-bag". My wife has one as does my son. Mine has a bit more than theirs.



Water is first and foremost. My wife carries 2L and my son 2L and I carry 3L.



My pack updated to a surplus military day pack. I went through it and made a few changes this year. My son, now bigger inherited my old pack.

In my pack I carry in no particular order:



* Binoculars

* Multitool

* Knife

* Knife sharpener

* Granola/energybars

* electrolyte drink mix packets

* Lip balm

* Bug spray

* Sunscreen

* Blastmatch (steel and flint)

* Vaseline soaked cotton balls (fire starter)

* Parachute cord

* Rite in Rain notebook

* Rite in Rain pen

* Single "A" cell tactical LED flashlight w/ spare batteries

* Hand crank LED headlamp w/battery back up

* Kite and string

* Gloves

* First aid kit w/ aspirin, bandages, feminine hygiene pad, Neosporin, catgut and needle

* Emergency blanket

* Storm whistle

* Chem light stick

* Bandanna

* Shock cord and hooks

* Netting

* Mosquito net for head

* Oregon Scientific UV / temp gauge

* VX-7R ham radio w/spare battery and longer range antenna

* BLT Magtags

* SS signal mirror

* Compass

* Carabiners x2

* Berkey filter water bottle

* Spare water bladder with tube and bite valve



I keep it in my truck all the time an throw it on when I head "out-there" on the bike.
 
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"BLT Magtags". What is this?
 

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My experience is that an overloaded bike/rider is a threat to his or her own safety and to the safety of others. I will not ride with anyone who shows up for a day ride with panniers, topcase, tank bag, and backpack stuffed to the brim. Such folks are either accident prone and/or going to fall because of all the extra weight.



About all one needs in a survival kit is water, a tourniquet, and a clean cloth to apply direct pressure to a wound. The clean cloth can double as a bandage or ties for splints for the trip out. These three items will take care of 99.9% of medical emergencies that one can actually do something about in the field. Everything else is a comfort or entertainment item not critical to immediate survival.



As for tools and parts, there is no sense carrying anything you don't know how to fix. Swap out the Phillips screws for Allen heads--they are less prone to slip and are smaller, lighter, and stronger than screwdrivers. Sort tools and carry only those that actually fit the bike. Do a complete tune and service on your bike, then take only those tools you used. Pack small vice grips, bailing wire, tubes, patch kit, a means to inflate the tire, a bit of fuel line, a bit of chain and a couple master links, and call it good. Add a knife, chain breaker, racer tape, kitchen matches in a waterproof container, flashlight, and some toilet paper and/or baby wipes, and you're good to go.



Whatever you do, don't bring a headlight or caplight. You walk up to me and look at me, rudely blinding me with your stupid caplight, and I'll likely give your light a good smack.
 

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"BLT Magtags". What is this?
A stack of cards attached to magnets. Our Calling card when Geocaching. Not probably a critical item, although the magnets might be used to turn a needle into a compass?



I would say that I have used more bandaids and antiseptic cream on scrapes and small cuts , than anything else in my emergency medical kit. I don't count the bug spray and sunscreen as being in those supplies or those would come first as the most used.

FYI, tourniquets are old school. Unless you monitor circulation carefully and release them as required, they can do more harm than good. Direct pressure is more effective and a better choice. Older training was in the use of tourniquets. In the last few years things have changed in all but the most extreme and remote situations. If you use a tourniquet, plan on amputating everything below it. Medical assistance today is pretty fast. Pack and pressure can save the limb.

Stock your supplies according to your level of training. I would suggest that knowledge is a tool that will serve you well and fills that unused space upstairs. How about taking night classes for a year and becoming an EMT? There are wilderness medic courses and even farm first aid. Anything is helpful.



The headlamps are very useful in food preparation and while eating. I agree that they can be annoying when shined into the face. I try to keep mine turned downward and off when visiting. Hands free low power consumption lights are a very useful thing to carry.



My son and I gave strike-any-where waterproof matches in waterproof capsules as stocking stuffers this year. We dipped three boxes of matches in wax and added a piece of wet-or-dry sandpaper to each package. The containers are high visibility colors. It was kind of a fun project. Low cost and easy to put together. That is one thing that each of our packs has added this year.



I will agree with keeping things light and the importance of water. My day pack now has room to add a coat. It is not stuffed full. My wife's and son's packs are just hydration packs, so not too big and designed for hiking. They each contain all the essentials that my pack does. I have a few more items, but they can still build fire and shelter, along with food supplies and tools. Each has a waist belt and padded shoulder straps. They need to be comfortable enough to wear all day long. We take them every time we venture out.
 

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I'm beginning to think I should consider turning at least one of my AgriSupply tubes I've mounted on my TW into a "Survival Kit."


Truelight, I think this is an excellent idea to use one of your AgriSupply Tubes (after burners ha ha), as a survival/medical kit. Henry J mentioned a lot of good things one could use.

Because of where I ride, I don't need too much to carry, and what has been pointed out, carrying too much can be a burden by getting in the way, off balance issues etc.



A stack of cards attached to magnets. Our Calling card when Geocaching. Not probably a critical item, although the magnets might be used to turn a needle into a compass?


Ah, used for geocaching. I'm too new into caching to have heard the term. Thanks



Your survival list is pretty cool. Even if I don't ride with a kit like yours on the TW, it still sounds like a good thing to have in the truck at the trailhead or campsite. Thanks for providing the list of things you carry.
 

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I would like to comment on HenryJ posting about his wife and son only carrying the hydration pack, if you read about our adventure on the Willie Boy thread, one thing we learned is that we each should carry the same thing in the event we get seperated again (hopefully never!). Typically when Lizrdbrth and I ride, he carry all of the emergency kits and tools in order to keep my bike light. Luckily, when we got seperated, I knew what to do since I have some backpacking experiences and survival training, I knew what to do for my safety. However, we wonder what would happen if he had an accident while searching for me or when we were riding together and I can't access his bike then we are unprepared. We have learned from now on, that each bike will be equipped with the necessary kits and tools in case of an emergency.



FYI - instead of vaseline soak cotton balls which tends to dry out if it not properly stored. Many backpacker carry dryer lint which is light and can be compacted into a small container.
 

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I would like to comment on HenryJ posting about his wife and son only carrying the hydration pack...that each bike will be equipped with the necessary kits and tools in case of an emergency.
Good point and I should clarify. Each of our packs contains the essentials for survival. Tools to build shelter, emergency rations, fire starters, etc. My pack carries a few extra items, but each is tailored to the individual and has what they might need if SHTF.

Their "packs" are hydration packs. Mine is a day pack that is a little larger. I can carry their "extra" stuff if I need to.

My wife uses the first bug-out bag that I put together many years ago. When it became hers we added her gloves, lipstick and a few other feminine items that might be needed. At that time I put together my next pack. My son wore a very compact bicycle hydration pack while he was young. It had a multi-tool , whistle, compass, binoculars and a few granola bars. This year he inherited my second gen Camelpack. He is older requiring more water and able to carry more. We retired his small pack and I put together the one I carry now that he inherited mine.



Each party needs to have with them what they need and not rely upon another where separation might happen.



Each needs to know the basics, but not everyone should be expected to know it all. for instance, I carry tire irons and tools to change a tire, or repair a tube. My wife does not. She does not have the strength, nor does she wish to undertake such a task. Her bike does carry a tool kit and she could do some basic repairs if needed. More than likely she would wait for help, or hike to safety if the bike were disabled. I hope we never have that situation and do not plan to put her into it.



Know the strengths and weaknesses. Teach them survival tactics and practice them. Do what works for your climate and terrain. We live in the desert and practice water conservation, finding water, night time navigation. It can be lots of fun




I think the tool tube survival kit is not a bad idea. Make what ever you place in it convenient to carry, or the tube removable with a cord to carry it. Survival will probably not include the bike if it is out of fuel. It can be stripped for items that might be useful and carried to a place of shelter , or rescue.
 

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I'll add something. Make sure someone know's where your going and when you expect to return. In other words file a flight plan!
 

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I am a firm believer that your best survival kit should rest on top of your shoulders! Seriously go armed with knowledge and don't be stupid! Stay calm and make smart calculated decisions! You can have all the gear you want but it all comes down to using your head!
 

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I guess qwerty won't ride with me, because I keep a bunch of stuff on the bike at all times and supplement it a bit for long rides.

Here's my list - realize I'm an old backpacker.

1 liter water

Extra gloves (winter)

Small day pack

Wet wipes

Cloth for cleaning glasses and visor

Notebook, pencil, and pen

Fuel filter

Lighter and matches

Sunblock packet

Biofreeze pain gel packets

Small rolls of horse wrap (bandage)

Strip of double-sided velcro for brake

Breakfast bar

Toilet tissue

Plastic garbage bag

Insect repellant packets

Folding knife

Open ended wrench for both rear axle nuts

Small crescent (wrapped in shop cloth)

Pliers

Signal mirror

Siphon tube/ fuel line

8 extra long nylon ties

6' heavy nylon cord

Caribiner flashlight

Misc bandages, bandaids, & antibiotic salve

Candle

Lip balm

Bar of soap

Catalytic hand warmers

Nylon poncho

Rain pants

Cell phone and gps are thrown in at last minute. Tom

Orange ball cap

Whoops almost forgot: As I checked my stash of pills I discovered the small supply of ipupropen that I carry had vibrated nearly to dust. Now the bottle is packet with aleve and a decongestant packed with cotton balls to reduce vibration. Things do vibrate back there. Most of this stuff fits in an old cd case fitting under the oem rack and or in the cd case that I use as a tank bag. Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I'm sure everyone would put together a slightly different kind of kit. I figure I should be able to get the essentials into the storage tube. One thing I'm surprised not to see on many lists is a "space blanket." I would think the ability to stay warm and dry would be high on the list of priorities. I'd also guess the reflective nature of a space blanlet would make you more visible, reflect the sun (again increasing visibility), and perhaps also keep you cooler if you were out in hot direct sun. They are also very compact.



I like the fact that some of you are actually listing items as I plan to make my own "composite" list from them with the items I think could be useful to me.



I also received a SPOT GPS locator for Christmas which I think will be a nice safety measure. (This is being discussed here in another thread).



I'm not looking to outfit the bike for an "expeditionary adventure," but I do know how even an unplanned and unprepared overnight in the Idaho backcountry because of a simple mechanical problem would be unpleasant at best and life-threatening at worst.
 

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Truelight, I bought a space blanket way back in the mid 70s and have carried it innumerable miles in my backpack, car, 4x4, etc. and I've never had need to use it. I guess it worked well enough. I like the idea of some kind of poncho or tarp because rain and sun are just as bothersome as cold in areas where I ride. I like the idea of matches, a candle, and extra gloves for warmth and just never got around to adding the space blanket to the MC. Consider taking a sewing machine and turning your space blanket into a tinfoil lined bag like a sleeping bag - it will keep you much warmer. Keep riding and don't let the safety stuff bog you down - I guess thats what Qwerty is saying. Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #15
This was interesting, not because I need a survival kit to support 6-7 people, but just as a way to see what might be included if cost and size/weight were no object. -



http://fourseasonssurvival.3dcartstores.com/-Aviation-6-7-Crash-Kit_p_931.html



There are some good ideas to be gleaned from this.



One item I find odd that many kits seem to include is fishing line and fish hooks. I'm challenged to catch fish even with a full set of gear. Then of course you'd have to be near a body of water that even had fish in it. The other concern would be what to use for bait. Heck, it would be better to have some kind of mini zip-gun and a handfull of 22 shells and at least maybe you could shoot something (though the accuracy of something like that might be poor. Or maybe a mousetrap that could be used to catch a mouse or even a squirrel. Yum! (not!) I think I'll stock a few energy bars instead.
 

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Not to turn this into a survival thread, but should the SHTF, assess your situation carefully before leaving your bike behind. Even if it's totally pretzeled it can be a McGyver's dream for its fuel, tires, plastics, seat and oil that burn brightly at night and smoke obnoxiously by day, a horn, mirrors, lights, it can provide partial shelter, inner tubes can transport water or fuel, tire irons, wiring and plastics can stabilize an injury, etc. Your bike is potentially part of your survival kit.



Lots of folks walk away from this resource (or worse, their car or truck, which is this resource, times 10) and die. You, your gear, your bike and assorted bike parts can present a pretty sizeable mass from the air compared to just the top of your pointy liddle noggin truckin' through the bush. Rescuers, if any will initially be looking for a dude on a bike. Particularly if injured, consider looking like that dude for as long as possible by not leaving your bike. And should you choose to walk away from it, consider taking some of its parts and pieces with you. At least tear off a mirror, er sumpin'.
 

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Most of what you folks call survival gear isn't necessary for survival. If someone knows to expect you back and where you were supposed to be going you'll be found the next day. You won't starve in 24 hours. You won't even die of thirst in 24 hours. How many of you carry shoes comfortable for walking? Without good shoes, you're not going very far. Think about what you need to survive--you already have most of it without packing any survival gear at all. Don't duplicate capabilities and you can be adequately protected without carrying a huge load. All my tools, parts, and survival gear fit in a medium size tank bag, along with snacks and a camera. Reason is I've thought about carrying products with multiple capabilities.



Bandaids are a convenience item, not a survival item. A clean cloth carried to apply pressure to stop bleeding makes a dandy bandage. A bit of the anti-bacterial dish soap I carry for tire lube cleans a wound nicely. No cream necessary. I think twice before riding with someone who accidently cuts themselves on a regular basis, anyway. I expect my riding partners to be more careful.



Flint and steel for fire starting? Toss the steel, you have a toolkit full of steel. Toilet paper makes dandy tinder. Pliars work quite well to shred kindling into tinder-squeeze and twist. Why do you need a fire, anyway? Survival foods are already cooked, and it's not like a fire will really warm you up unless you know how to bank the heat.



Headlights and flashlights are for camping. If you're involved in camping and cooking after dark, your camping or cooking, not trying to survive. If you are faced with an unintended overnight in the wilderness, you'd better be set up for the night before dark. If you are lost you really need to stop in time to make camp before dark. If you have no time to make camp before dark when the SHTF, you are close enough to walk out. In fact, no light is necessary to survive. I've spent many nights in wildernesses without a flashlight just by stopping soon enough to make camp before dark. If the truth be known, most flashlight use in campsites after dark is peering out at the spooky sounds. Unless it is 100% overcast allow your eyes to become accustomed to the dark and you'll be able to see well enough to walk out. If you have a fire, avoid looking at it or wear your sunglasses and the night won't seem so dark.



Also, nearly every environment has shelter if you know where to look. A tent will keep you no dryer than a motorcycle rain suit. More comfortable, maybe, but not dryer. Therefore, a tent is a comfort item, not a survival item.



How many of you plan to use your motorcycle gear for insulation should you be caught out on a cold night? Instead, you plan a whole different method of insulation to replace insulation you already have. Sure, sleeping in gear and a helmet may not be all that comfortable, but it really is warm, even mesh dualsport gear under a rainsuit is warmer than a summer sleeping bag. Think about how many people bitch about how hot gear and a rainsuit are. You'd be surprised how comfortable riding gear and a rainsuit can be if you can find a natural feature with the shape of a recliner, or create the shape.



Peruano, I like your idea of an orange ball cap. I wear polyester insulating, windproof, and waterproof layers that meet ANSI Class 3 visibility standards for highway work. In summer I wear a Class 3 t-shirt under my yellow mesh gear. It isn't necessary to carry the cap for visibility if your clothes will do the job better. I do carry a roll-up hat, either waterproofed cotton duck or an evaporative cooling hat depending on weather, but that is comfort gear, not survival gear. I wish I could find high-vis hats like those that are high visibility. Better visibility certainly wouldn't hurt.



What it all comes down to is most of you are no better off with your survival luggage than I am because what little I do carry fills so many possible needs. I carry very little dedicated survival gear because so much of the other stuff I carry will do what I need. Think about multi-purpose items and you can rteduce your survival cargo to next to nothing. Frankly, I think most people who find themselves in "survival" situations do so intentionally and actually enjoy their impromptu campouts.
 

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Gulp, I guess I hijacked the thread and listed everything I carry (and not stuff for survival). In my area of the woods, you need to protect against 3 or 4 dangers. Bleeding to death (carry a roll of horse wrap - the elastic stick to itself abilities allows you to turn any piece of clothing into a bandage or splint; Heat, cold, and dehydration. The remedies for these are obvious. I do agree with Qwerty in that too many folks are bogging themselves down with stuff that is not likely to be needed during the trip (whether 3 hours or 3 weeks). Examples are things like spare spark plugs - not likely to fail so why carry them. Some of my stuff is convenience and some a bit more of a careful nature.

Lzdbrth sounds like a southern Californian (as he is) in talking about the guys who run out of gas and walk away from the motorcycle in Baja and sometimes are walking always just ahead of the rescue team. I've heard about them too many times and have a friend who participated in those maddening searches.

Cheers and back to survival stuff for Truelight. Tom
 

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LOL. We live in similar country. A naked, redheaded supermodel doesn't look much different from a creosote bush at 300 yards.



+1 on the horse wrap. Light weight and double duty. Feed stores and vet suppllies can be worth a walk-thru.



I carry a couple of iodine nuggets from my horseshoeing box. Purifies water and can be reconstituted into a potent antiseptic. Not for everyone, though. Potent stuff if you don't have a feel for it. Iodine water purification tablets probably easier to gauge for the same purposes. Shake a few around with water in the little green container they typically are sold in until dissolved.



Pills and tablets can turn to dust. I'm not so anal about these as I used to be, but some first responders seal things like painkillers individually in short pieces of drinking straws or shrink tubing with a hot knife. That way if they turn to dust in your kit they're still usable, the dosage is right and unlikely to be mixed with the dust of more benign and less expensive meds. If you use shrink tubing buy the crappiest, thinnest kind you can get or you'll need a saw to get to the pill.



Tyvek house wrap is all the rage with backpackers these days. I have a tent footprint I made from it, but the footprint was so useful that I've started carrying it in my tank bag. A 4x6 sheet weighs a few ounces, tough as nails and free of charge if you work it right. Good for shelter, a man or deer drag, bike cover, locator etc. I've never been able to keep a space blanket alive for more than 6 months on a bike or on horseback in its original packaging, but that's just me.
 

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Interesting thread. I suspect HenryJ has this down to a science. I seem to follow Tom's example, keeping in mind "survival" and 'comfort' as well. I carry an extra pair of wool socks; should I ride through, or fall into a stream I can continue through the day in comfort (dry feet). I have learned as well, socks do a pretty good job of keeping your hands warm. Last spring when I visited my Dr. I got a prescription for a couple of Vicadin which I carry on the bike. My thought is (have never taken the drug) should I fall and find myself in pain I may be afforded a chance to get back on the bike, or at least remain trailside feeling less pain...



My guess is, for most of us, it will not be a question of "survival" it will generally boil down to comfort. I have my horse wrap, firestarter and signal mirror. I carry a quart of water (should be more) but in the mountains a small filter supplements. What has gotten the most use is the 'extra' wool sweater and large 2mil garbage bag that I always carry in my side packs. More than once my day long adventure has extended into early evening. Spring days can be nice and warm. Spring evenings at 45mph can bite right thru a couple of shirts and a nice wind breaker. Then again, an unexpected thunderstorm in the hills can mean discomfort for the poorly prepared, my garbage bag folds small and is always at the ready. I enjoy thinking about 'preparedness' but for me so far, the hardest thing has been trying to "decide" if I am lost. Most of the time when in the great outdoors I am prepared to spend a day or two "waiting for help" but so far, I have pressed on. Granted, I am here to tell my story, which suggests that I did the right thing (?). My concern is, I may not be so inclined to yield should it be the 'wrong' time to keep moving. Gerry



If you look at my hands, you will see I am wearing socks. At this point, I considered myself a well seasoned cyclist. I always wore cycling gloves in case of a "bad fall". Given my ride on this trip, I never expected to go fast enough to fall (silly me). As well, I never epected the sunburn to the top of my hands would be so painful..............





 
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