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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
No more rope, Ancra's cam locks or ratchet straps for me.
I bolt my TW to the carrier via some welded on stanchions that the footage brackets rest upon. Similar in concept to the MotoJack it results in bike frame rigidly bolted to carrier but with 4 rather than two restraining fasteners.
Quick & extremely secure both during loading and transit. No more strap ends to secure, seems to give improved fuel mileage without all the straps in the turbulent slipstream. Plus it gives a nice clean look. I've found no need for secondary securement of front or rear tires to carrier since bolts compress suspension making tires immobile. Should have done this years ago. Absolutely no wiggle of bike relative to carrier. A very pleasant surprise that seems to work so well.
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It has been on a couple of trips, holds either TW well despite their different suspensions, tires, wheelbases and ground clearance to footpegs. Stanchion height is such that from the variety of slopes and inclinations so far I can just roll bike on until wheels drop into rack depressions then can let go of bike and the stanchions hold bike upright without any needed assistance, Very safe, no risk of bike falling off or hitting back glass of vehicle.
I use common 1/2" 13 coarse thread per inch bolts since they are readily available and take same 3/4"/ 19mm socket as hitch tightener and TW axle bolts. Fine thread 20 thread per inch would be more secure but harder to find in back of beyond hardware stores should I ever loose one. Swivel head ratchet & a moderate extension makes bolting/unbolting easy.
I believe this modification can be done to most any carrier. Stanchions can even be done to be bolt-on with variable height and spacing to accommodate multiple motorcycle configurations. Nothing has vibrated loose in about 400 highway miles and a dozen bumpy dirt track miles.
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There is still room for improvements in the first iteration prototype. Aluminum top plates are now reversed to grab seated footpegs better. Ramp is strapped on for now but a similar bolt restraint system is contemplated so I can leave the bungee cords at home too.
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Just resurrecting my long dormant and rather limited high school metal shop welding skills.
Actually was getting dissapointed in difficulty using the MotoJack on a lifted rig yet simultaneously having to put up with reduced ground clearance to Motojack's frame at the same time.
Anyone wishing to replicate this should start with adjusting carrier so that bike rests with footpegs inline with receiver hitch. While this puts center of Grabbity ( footpegs) over stanchions it does put center of Gravity slightly to one side.
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While this clever swivel head ratchet quickly takes care of bolts a cordless impact gun or drill twisting the 3/4 socket would really speed things up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Very nice Brian!
You build that to tow another TW as a spare on our next "Easy Ride" together?
I was thinking the clamp-down rather than tie-down idea would could very well on any trailer. I always like compression over tension restraints anyways. My Trailer clamps 2 TW at a time with forks against wooden uprights in custom slots, compression rather than tension straps again.
The bases I bolt to are 5" wide to accommodate the inconsistent placement of bike ride after ride, and as KEN so rightfully pointed out I do have a habit of bending my footpegs from banging on rocks.
 
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Yep, I agree. Combine that problem with no suspension and the rigid quad axle and that is why this concept has not gone any further. May still proceed with a torsion axle setup.

Here's a commercial version of Fred's homegrown solution.

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks folks.
The RISK Lock-n-Load sure is nice but when Black Friday Deals have them for $200 or $300 out-the-door (depending on model) it might be time to break out the welder...or buy a welder.:cool:
Other than buying 1/2 bolts and new cut-off wheels for the angle grinder my project used scrap metal on hand and my old $100 Harbor Freight wire feed welder.
Ken's comment that I can be hard on footpegs reminded me to get a couple of long eye bolts to screw into stanchions to trap and strap TW frame to should I shear off a foot peg mount.
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Well Fred,
Not bad Partner, not bad at all. I've been welding and fabricating since Christ was a pup and it's always nice to see someone engineer something that's used both as a practical and reliable as what you've done. Yes, the straps can be a bit of a pain if they're used as much as you do on a regular basis. You've more than likely seen how I carry the Dub on the back of our motorhome but, as a reminder, a pic is provided. You've used a hydraulic jack (Motojack) system for quite some time now and, apparently it's worked for you just fine.

As you've stated, your system is a sort-a prototype. Well, if I may make just a slight suggestion or two. I'm always looking to improve my own designs and fabrications, when possible. If you're happy with what you've done so far, then by all means, leave and go have the normal fun you do. But, in case you're thinking of "the next version", maybe these ideas might be considered.

Your Dub rides at the same foot peg height for ever doesn't it? In other words, there's pretty much no change in peg-to-ground height, right? So, what I might suggest in one change is, build your stansions so that, when the bike approaches its resting place at the end of its travel, it (the foot pegs) very, very slightly, slides up a slight ramp, on each side, and then the last few inches, they slide the rest of the way, on horizontal pads. An addition to this suggestion might be something like this. In the many, many years of brand new fire truck outfitting, I was tasked with providing indestructive surfaces that heavy tools, ladders, and anything that had to be SLID out and back in, could slide on with out fear of damaging both the sliding surface and the tool in question.

For that purpose, we started using what's called UHMW plastic. UHMW stands for Ultra High Molecular Weight. It's a plastic that looks very similar to your average cutting board plastic. Only, it's at a minimum several times stronger and way more abrasion resistant. We'd put the heaviest tools on a fire truck on that stuff and, after years of sliding, hammering, throwing, yanking and any other torcher one could apply in removing and re-installing tools in a fire truck compartment, ZERO damage to that UHMW surface.

So, with all that crap being said, you could line the slight ramp surface with some UHMW plastic and the bottom sides of your pegs would simply glide right up and sit on that UHMW. Now, by doing it that way, your little Dub is already stable and would not fall in either direction.

Another suggestion. Instead of using independent brackets with nuts and bolts, you fabricate up, some swing-over levers/clamps with T-handled permanently attached bolts. So, as the Dub is sitting there, you grab these swing over levers and, they simply swing over the top of your foot pegs, front to back and, the T-handle bolts, are already positioned to, and touching, the beginning threads of a welded on receiving nut, on the bottom side of the brackets that the Dubs pegs are on.

Are you seeing what I'm describing? It's simple. Run the bike up and slide it onto the two ramps and purchases. The bike is not stable. Swing the left side lever with T-handle bolt over the left peg and, spin the T-handle bolt down tight enough that you're happy with it. Then, reach over and swing the right one up and over the right foot peg, and tighten that T-handle bolt. Now, to keep those T-handle bolts from backing themselves out, a hole has been drilled right through the middle of the threads, just under the welded nut, and a bobby pin type cinch pin is inserted, DONE!

No wrenches, no tools, and no bolts. Everything is permanently attached and, when it comes time to remove the bike, yank each bobby pin cinch pin, spin the T-handled bolts to remove them, flip both clamps forward and the bike rolls off the carrier. Just some suggestions here Sir. Oh, by the way, you can also put small cables onto those bobby pins and attach the small cables to the stanchions so they too would be permanent.
Scott
 

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DAMN, but there are some smart MoFos on here...I feel like such a dummy!

Fire Up...do you have an idea of the empty weight of this carrier..without the weight of the added receiver and hitch arrangement, ahead of the Versa-Haul?
I'm trying to configure something similar to go behind a new camper trailer.

Thanks!

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Good ideas FIRE UP.
The slide idea would work very well for the stock suspension TW but the one with Tri-Z forks and Banshee/Rapter hybrid shock sits an inch or more higher. Different wheel bases between the bikes also made me want to build in additional flexibility including ability to carry a bone stock TW, or a damaged TW (Betty Boop has a 2" extended swing arms and longer rake of Nibbler's long travel forks make for a variety of spatial relationships relative to the carrier ). As is my uprights, or stanchions, are only about 3/8" below footage brackets for an inflated ATV tire, ~1.5" for Nibbler's Trailwing rear tire. A flat tire might make loading difficult as is.
For the bikes to initially be self supporting the stanchions have to bear upon the foot peg brackets, not the footpegs themselves as they pivot which would dump bike either into back glass or off the rear upside down. Minor detail but your principle is both sound and a good idea.
I thought of a T-handle design but elected to avoid risk of catching myself or the bike on the "T" while unloading as I roll bike off going forward. Also the 2 tight fasteners per side offers more piece of mind since they are only restraints; I get a little redundancy at expense of a little convenience while 4x4-ing to most camp sites.
Thanks for the suggestions. Next challenge would be to make some supports like your VersaHualer has that extend from haul vehicle that limit rocking motion of carrier itself as main tube from receiver actually twists, the only motion I detect when driving on irregular terrain. Since almost all my van/TW trips entail off-roading to a base camp I fear ultimate fatigue failure or a weld failure may do me in. Perhaps re-inforcing existing welds with strap wrapping around 2" and stiffening receiver tube and tube/stanchion joint might be next feasible improvement.
 
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DAMN, but there are some smart MoFos on here...I feel like such a dummy!

Fire Up...do you have an idea of the empty weight of this carrier..without the weight of the added receiver and hitch arrangement, ahead of the Versa-Haul?
I'm trying to configure something similar to go behind a new camper trailer.

Thanks!

View attachment 220316
Hey Darth,
well, what you see in that picture is:
1. Factory 10,000 lb. trailer hitch/receiver
2. 6" high x 12" long solid steel lower, 1/4" wall upper, riser/extension
3. Versa-Haul single rail, 500 lb. capacity bike hauler with built in tow/receiver.
4. Blue Ox Avail (Model name) 10,000 lb. capacity tow bar.

The extension/riser weighs close to 25 lbs or so, especially because of the solid 2" x 2" x 12" slider that enters the factory hitch/receiver.
The Versa-Haul hovers probably real close to 80-90 lbs or so.
The tow bar, right around 25-30 lbs.

I have two versions of this setup. The first is what you see already pictured. Since the T-dub only tips the scales at a whopping 278 lbs, and, the Versa Haul is rated at 500 lbs., there's no need for any additional weight-carrying support added to the system. That receiver that's built into the Versa-Haul, is rated at 3,000 lbs. Of course our Jeep hovers close to 4,500 or more. So, as usual, I wander outside the box here. Knowing a bit about metal, and what it will take in given circumstances, the 3,000 lbs limit Versa Haul labels this model with, is their version of a safety factor. So, the 4,500 lbs. I tow with it, is quite fine.

But, I have the second version of this system. All that version entails is, two additional 2" x 2" receivers, mounted to the coach frame. And, (2) custom bent, 2" x 2" x 3/16" wall, extensions that butt up to and, support the bottom side of that Versa-Haul. That version of my system, is used when I want to haul my 2018 Honda Africa Twin Adventure Sports DCT. That bike hovers right close to 540 lbs. The ability for that Versa-Haul to carry the A/T's weight would be taxed. But, more importantly, as Fred illuded to in a previous post, there's a form of a teeter-totter affect that, could and would put torsional stress on the center receiver.

So, why not just bolster things up a little? So, when the A/T's gonna tag along with us on a trip, out comes the 2" x 2" x 36" custom bent extensions. I add those, then bolt them to the Versa-Haul. Then, when everything is in place, I add what you see in the pics at all intersections of a slider and receiver. And those are called Hitch tighteners. I made those too. When this version is being used, and we're towing (which is 100% of the time), I use FIVE of those hitch tighteners. When all those hitch tighteners are tight, that entire assembly is like one solid, welded piece of metal. There is absolutely ZERO flex or, teeter-totter at all.

The addition of the custom bent extensions, adds about, another 5-6 lbs. each.

Loading and un loading the TW is basically childs play. I can push it right up that ramp and onto the Versa-Hauler with relative ease, especially is the air suspension of the coach is empty. Then the coach sits around 4" lower than when it's aired up. But, when I want to drag along the A/T, that's a whole 'nother world. I can't even think about PUSHING that A/T up that ramp and keeping it stable while doing it. Sooooo, for that operation, I add some temporary Scaffolding and another ramp. My Africa Twin is the DCT version or, otherwise known as a FULLY AUTOMATIC motorcycle. Yep, no clutch, no shifting, nothing. It's just like a car, start it, push the "D" button on the bars and, twist the throttle and you're gone!

So, when it comes time to load the A/T onto the back of the coach, out comes the scaffolding and additional temp ramp. I start the bike, put it in D, and very carefully, WALK alongside that A/T as I very carefully use the throttle to power that bike up the ramp. When we're both up at the top and the bike has hit the front chock, the CEO attaches the front two straps. That stabilizes the bike and I can hop down and do the rest.

Anyway, sorry for the War and Piece novel but, I just wanted you to know what I do, and how things are designed to allow us to take along, various toys and our Jeep. Hope it's cleared some things up. BY all means, if there's any questions, be sure to ask. Be glad to help.
Scott
 

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Fred,
I pretty much figured you'd have alternate plans and or bikes for your system. But I thought I'd throw out my ideas at ya just the same. And, concerning the "ramps" and or perches where the bike sits when tying it down, yes, I understand that you could NOT use the foot pegs because of the tilt effect. And you'd have to use the foot peg mounts for that. Your idea of the stansions and lower frame support, has been banteed about several times on one of the Honda Goldwing forums for years. Many of those riders believe that using tie downs that compress the suspension ruins it or, at the very least degrades it. So, when it comes time for hauling road sofa, they install some blocks under the center section so the suspension does not compress.

Well, I've hauled our Wing all over the country by tieing the bike down and compressing the suspension for a few zillion miles and years, and that suspension still worked as good the day I sold (actually traded it in on my Africa Twin) it, as it did 10 years earlier when we bought it. Absolutely zero damage to that suspension.

Anyway, without a doubt, you certainly have thought things out in your approach for hauling Betty or, any other toy. Maybe just a few refinements, if needed at a later date/time, might be all you need if you see fit. Good luck with your new version of hauling your toys.
Scott
 

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Hey Darth,
well, what you see in that picture is:
1. Factory 10,000 lb. trailer hitch/receiver
2. 6" high x 12" long solid steel lower, 1/4" wall upper, riser/extension
3. Versa-Haul single rail, 500 lb. capacity bike hauler with built in tow/receiver.
4. Blue Ox Avail (Model name) 10,000 lb. capacity tow bar.

The extension/riser weighs close to 25 lbs or so, especially because of the solid 2" x 2" x 12" slider that enters the factory hitch/receiver.
The Versa-Haul hovers probably real close to 80-90 lbs or so.
The tow bar, right around 25-30 lbs.

I have two versions of this setup. The first is what you see already pictured. Since the T-dub only tips the scales at a whopping 278 lbs, and, the Versa Haul is rated at 500 lbs., there's no need for any additional weight-carrying support added to the system. That receiver that's built into the Versa-Haul, is rated at 3,000 lbs. Of course our Jeep hovers close to 4,500 or more. So, as usual, I wander outside the box here. Knowing a bit about metal, and what it will take in given circumstances, the 3,000 lbs limit Versa Haul labels this model with, is their version of a safety factor. So, the 4,500 lbs. I tow with it, is quite fine.

But, I have the second version of this system. All that version entails is, two additional 2" x 2" receivers, mounted to the coach frame. And, (2) custom bent, 2" x 2" x 3/16" wall, extensions that butt up to and, support the bottom side of that Versa-Haul. That version of my system, is used when I want to haul my 2018 Honda Africa Twin Adventure Sports DCT. That bike hovers right close to 540 lbs. The ability for that Versa-Haul to carry the A/T's weight would be taxed. But, more importantly, as Fred illuded to in a previous post, there's a form of a teeter-totter affect that, could and would put torsional stress on the center receiver.

So, why not just bolster things up a little? So, when the A/T's gonna tag along with us on a trip, out comes the 2" x 2" x 36" custom bent extensions. I add those, then bolt them to the Versa-Haul. Then, when everything is in place, I add what you see in the pics at all intersections of a slider and receiver. And those are called Hitch tighteners. I made those too. When this version is being used, and we're towing (which is 100% of the time), I use FIVE of those hitch tighteners. When all those hitch tighteners are tight, that entire assembly is like one solid, welded piece of metal. There is absolutely ZERO flex or, teeter-totter at all.

The addition of the custom bent extensions, adds about, another 5-6 lbs. each.

Loading and un loading the TW is basically childs play. I can push it right up that ramp and onto the Versa-Hauler with relative ease, especially is the air suspension of the coach is empty. Then the coach sits around 4" lower than when it's aired up. But, when I want to drag along the A/T, that's a whole 'nother world. I can't even think about PUSHING that A/T up that ramp and keeping it stable while doing it. Sooooo, for that operation, I add some temporary Scaffolding and another ramp. My Africa Twin is the DCT version or, otherwise known as a FULLY AUTOMATIC motorcycle. Yep, no clutch, no shifting, nothing. It's just like a car, start it, push the "D" button on the bars and, twist the throttle and you're gone!

So, when it comes time to load the A/T onto the back of the coach, out comes the scaffolding and additional temp ramp. I start the bike, put it in D, and very carefully, WALK alongside that A/T as I very carefully use the throttle to power that bike up the ramp. When we're both up at the top and the bike has hit the front chock, the CEO attaches the front two straps. That stabilizes the bike and I can hop down and do the rest.

Anyway, sorry for the War and Piece novel but, I just wanted you to know what I do, and how things are designed to allow us to take along, various toys and our Jeep. Hope it's cleared some things up. BY all means, if there's any questions, be sure to ask. Be glad to help.
Scott
This reminds me of a boat I just saw in harbor here in San Diego called HODOR. (From the show Game Of Thrones)
It was impressive and it was the toy hauler for the true yacht the Lonian. Look up HODOR and be amazed at what the truly rich do for toys and toy hauling.
 
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