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Need some advice on Carb issues

4.5K views 30 replies 16 participants last post by  Fred  
#1 ·
So my bike is a '21 model. I played with the main jet, pilot, idle screw and got the machine running really well for months (very happy with it). Due to my wife and child having an extended stay in the hospital, the bike sat for 10-12 weeks. Of course when I got around to it, the bike had trouble starting so I replaced the pilot and that issue was fixed. So the bike will start and idle perfect and even be ok till 1/4 to 1/2 throttle. Went for a ride after I replaced the pilot and get a stuttering / stumbling hesitation at 1/4 or 1/2 throttle. Cannot exceed that throttle position without that stuttering / stumbling. During all of this I have pulled all of the jets and ensured they are clean. The one thing I have not done is checked the float needle. From what I understand there is a screen that could trap some debris. Based on the bike sitting for some time, it would make sense that there is a clogged orifice or something restricting fuel flow. Am I on the right track here or are there some additional things I need to check out as well?
Thanks in advance.
 
#8 ·
Since you have a low post count, I'm going to suggest double checking your work against a carb exploded part diagram and verify that all the tiny bits and pieces are accounted for and in their proper places. Did you work on the carb in the bike or did you remove it completely from the bike? Can you get to >3/4 throttle? Check for air leaks? Boots sealing properly?
 
#12 ·
The pilot jet (idle) has nothing to do with 1/4 to 1/2 throttle. Thats the job of the needle and main jet. (mid range) Did someone adjust the height of the needle? Theres notches in the top of it and a small e-clip to raise or lower it. Raising it will give more fuel at 1/4 to 1/2 throttle, lowering it will do the opposite. Check to make sure the diaphragm at the top of the carb is sealing and the slide is raising the needle. Maybe the slide is sticking.
 
#14 ·
Not actually true. The jets are cumulative. Meaning, the pilot jet is in circuit from zero to full on the throttle. At 1/4 to 1/2 throttle, the needle kicks in, added to the pilot.
Also, the TW200 needle does not have a e-clip with an adjustable needle. Any street legal motorcycle doesn't as far as I know. Only off road motorcycles have an adjustable clip position needle. In the case of the TW200, users use a shim washer of .1mm thickness on the needle to simulate moving the e-clip down in order to effect a richer setting.
 
#20 · (Edited)
Before tearing into the carb....try and pour in a little Sea Foam into the tank, and let it idle a bit. There could be something more, but try the easiest to start.

Had similar happen on my '09'er during first year I had it. Ran perfect. It sat for around 3 months, then it finally started and idled fine, but had the same bog when given a little throttle. Little Sea Foam, and poof!....it was running fine. Never any issues on-going. I then made sure to not let it sit too long before starting it periodically, or adding some fuel stabilizer.
 
#16 ·
1. Is needle jet right side up? (see JBFLA's photos)
2. Is diaphragm lifting slide and needle properly? (if diaphragm removed, was it reseated fully?)
3. Color of spark plug? (showing lean or rich?)
 
#18 ·
The basis for the 3 questions before speculating further is this:
At the throttle positions in question, is it running out of fuel, therefore too lean or is it getting too much fuel and therefore too rich.

 
#19 ·
Since I am leaving for a ride (with another veteran on veteran's day) and logging off soon, a few comments:
A vacuum leak would create a lean condition, but be more apparent at idle.
If the fuel cap/tank is not venting or bowl not venting, the result would be fuel starvation, bur be more apparent at higher RPMs
If the needle and/or needle jet is damaged, it would affect mixture, more so mid-range
If the float level is low, it would been lean, but more apparent as RPMs increase
If the enrichener is leaking or not seated, most likely richer, but more apparent at lowere RPMs
If the vacuum diaphragm is not seated or torn or pinhole, the slide would lift less, allowing less air and less mid-range fuel, so primarily a HP reduction.
 
#22 ·
Helps to jump in the “way back” machine to where it ran good and what changed. It sat, then hard to start. Presumably a constriction in the pilot circuit. But didn’t run better with cleaning, though started. That’s telling you what you need to know. I myself have a difficult time doing an effective carb cleaning without removing the carb. Pretty smart to follow other’s lead on enriching the mixture but smarter to get to where you started before tossing more on the pile.
A plugged vent line, tight valve etc could also be an issue as is time of year.
Do the CV carbs still have a plug over the pilot adjust? How did you remove that without removing carb? I’ve found it too tight myself. I find it challenging to read spark plugs with todays clean burning fuels.
 
#23 ·
Do the CV carbs still have a plug over the pilot adjust? How did you remove that without removing carb? I’ve found it too tight myself. I find it challenging to read spark plugs with todays clean burning fuels.
Yes, EPA still requires caps.
Easy to loosen both clamps, rotate carb (~80 degree max) and remove cap.
 
#28 ·
My condolences, SP3, as Hoppes has a delightful and endearing aroma.
 
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#30 ·
Don't be too quick to start replacing carb components. If your bike is a '21, I can almost guarantee you all the parts are physically fine. Brass doesn't corrode or get deformed in one year without something serious going wrong. It could get plugged up by debris in the tank, or bad gas sitting, but that can all be resolved with carb cleaner and physical cleaning. Replacing carb components might do more harm than good.

Couple tips for you--these are all mistakes that delayed me for weeks if not months messing around with my own carb:
-Try putting the original carb parts back in. Unless you buy OEM, aftermarket replacement parts may not be identical and can cause gremlins. That one literally cost me months of riding time as I didn't realize that the aftermarket main jet holder was not identical to OEM and that's why I could never get it to run right. Could only tell the difference on a very careful visual inspection.
-Check the float level in the float bowl. You can check it with a piece of transparent rubber hose, Google search how to do it. It's adjusted by bending a little metal tab, if that happened by mistake you could have too low a fuel level in the bowl which could cause all your symptoms.
-Impurities in the fuel are awful and can cause symptoms all through the system. I got screwed by a rusty tank for ages that kept putting rust particles in my fuel line after I thought I had cleaned it thoroughly. Add an inline fuel filter. Clean the living shit out of your carb with carb cleaner. And only run ethanol free gas if possible
-When in doubt, back everything off to factory spec and then try adjusting again. Factory pilot, factory main jet, no shims in the needle and mixture screw backed off 1.5 turns. Then, one adjustment at a time, try walking everything back in. You'll probably want the mixture screw more like 2.5 turns, start with that but just do half a turn at a time.

Good luck! With carb issues, always take it slow and don't change multiple things at a time.
 
#31 ·
Some minor elaboration to clarify previous posts:
Indeed the pilot jet does contribute, and effect fuel delivery throughout the RPM range on our CV carbs. This simple animation explains well.
CV Carburetor

While the OEM carbs do not have notches on the needle the replacement Chinese carbs I have seen do have the notches for the e-clip adjustment. This is another bonus for the $30 clone; use as is, or consider buying one a parts donor. Needle swap is easy.
For OEM carbs we add shims under needle retainer to accomplish same enriching effect of raising the needle.